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Message from Italy to Turkey
I will take non-acceptance as a decline. My offer is officially off the
table. I will make a similar offer to another power.
Roberto
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
I appreciate your communications, but I don't think it's reasonable for you to
expect me to disband one of only two fleets I've got on the board. I don't
think it's reasonable for you to expect me to rely on your support, when
you're the one who is attacking me. For the time being, I must rely on my own
resources and defend as best I can, until such time as you choose to stop your
attacks. But I think it's reasonable for me to ask that you take the first
step in reversing our conflict.
Not once have I ever attacked or betrayed Italian interests, even remotely. I
fought for Italian growth and stability, as well as Turkish, on both the
military and diplomatic fronts, right up until your (second) stab. I never
worked secretly behind your back, and I never had any plans on the table to
attack Italian interests. You paid me the compliment that I speak the truth;
well, in that spirit I will not make promises I cannot keep.
My options are few, indeed they're all but nonexistent. I can only defend. I
expect you to do what you think is best for Italy. If and when you feel that
Italian interests are best served by resuming relations with Turkey, if and
when your forces and mine are on a more even footing, if and when you stop
attacking me, then I will remain open to any realistic discussion about
resuming relations.
Ali
Message from France to Turkey
Ali:
Hello again. I finally have gotten a free moment to
write. I thought that we could talk about long term
plans. We need to work together to try and balance
England and Russia. I am sure that you would prefer a
stronger England and I would prefer a stronger Russia.
But if we want to improve our long term positions, we
should try to balance them. If one is too weak, the other
probably will not attack in fear that you or I would
gobble them up from behind. Hence, we want them even.
If we can then get them fighting, we can join together
and advance towards the end game. We have the option for
a two-way draw, which allows the game to come towards the
end. One may steal the victory, but that is still a
50-50 shot. The other option is likely a 3-way draw,
which is less palatable. I know that I am bold even
suggesting that I could get to that point, but it does
not hurt to dream and plan.
What do I suggest this turn? Not too much to cooperate
on. I am just asking for us to agree to work slowly
towards splitting Europe and seeing what happens. We
have gotten along quite well. I have helped you out
several times, giving you the information or assurances
to yourself or others. You helped to negotiate
cooperation between England and I. We are like brothers
and need to remember that! (I can't believe that I am
writing this sappy stuff)
OK, enough of that. Do you agree to work towards that
future? If you do agree, I will agree to stop writing
such sappy messages. If you don't I will drown you in so
much sugar and sentiment you may melt! :-)
--Prince Boar
Message from Master to all
I'd like to encourage End-Of-Year statements from all the players (in
"press to m" format) and from any interested observers as well (in
posts to the vgfp_titleist Yahoogroup.
Doug
Message from Russia to Turkey
Ali,
How are things in Constantinople? Have you heard from Fredd and/or
Roberto? France is coming after Roberto, so things should ease up for
you this year, and England is helping me against Germany, so we may be
able to stage a come-back. Please drop me a line when you can.
Thanks,
Nick.
Message from England to Turkey
Ali,
My moves are in. I have been encouraging France to hit Italy with all he
can. It's a little tricky, because France has to worry some about my
intentions. There is no way I would harm France now, and I hope the logic
of the situation is clear to him. Italy must not be permitted to set up an
impenetrable defense line against France, behind which he could still
dismantle you. I think that France knows that I know this and that
everything will turn out OK.
You should be able to recover fully, after which you will, once again, have
a wonderful position. As this becomes apparent, you and I need to consider
longer range strategy. I am confident that Germany is about to be
eliminated. Russia and France and I will pick up the pieces. I will most
definitely want your advice on what to do after that.
Ivy
Message from Turkey to Russia
Nick,
Good to hear from you. I'm obviously very pleased to see the French pressure
on the Med. Hopefully that will pull my fat from the fire, so to speak. I've
not heard from Fredd since before the last move result. I don't think he's
very happy with me for refusing to support him against you. I have given him
some hints that I would support him against Italy, but he's not replied, and I
don't think that would make England or France very happy.
Roberto wrote just after the move result to suggest I disband F Smy, promising
to throw all his efforts agaisnt France and support my own advances if I did.
As you've seen, I did not choose to disband the fleet. After the build
result, he wrote that his offer was withdrawn and he would make the same offer
to another player. The most likely candidates, I think, are you and Germany.
I do hope you will not join forces with Roberto at this point.
I was glad to see cooperation between you and England. You and he can do much
now to help each other. I hope you will be supporting him to Denmark, and he
supports you to StP. If France joins the effort, Germany could face a tough
year. For myself, I really don't have a lot of options. My moves will be
similar to my last fall move, in an effort to shore up my defenses and put
pressure on Italy wherever I can.
I hope all is going well on your end. I once again give you every assurance
that I will be doing nothing even remotely anti-Russian. All my efforts will
be against Italy. Best of luck to you in the result, and if there is anything
I can do on the diplomatic front please let me know.
Ali
Message from Turkey to France
Prince Boar,
Thanks for your letter. I agree entirely with everything you said. Indeed,
I've got some concerns with Russia growing strong, since it's likely that he
still bears me some grudges for my earlier transgressions. Likewise, I'm sure
you feel the same way about England. Although, I thought it was a good sign
that he was willing to give up Belgium to bolster your Med forces (or at least
that's how I interpret last fall's moves).
As for keeping E/R under control, I have little to offer. Tactically, my
efforts will be 100% focused on Italy, and I don't envision that changing real
soon. With your much-needed (and much-welcomed) fleet pressure, I don't think
Italy can hold out forever. But he is certainly strong, and it will take a
while to whittle him down. I don't think I'll be making any great leaps
forward in center counts, and in fact I have no real desire to do so anyway.
But if we can both grow slowly and steadily, then I'm confident we will
prevail.
About the only possible thing I can see to restrict E/R would be to support
Germany. I had mentioned to Fredd that I might be willing to support A Tyr
against Vie or something, but he has not replied. I think he's upset with me
for refusing to support him against Russia last year. What is your viewpoint,
are you planning to actively participate in anti-German efforts? If Germany
does request support against Vie, would you object to such a thing?
In any case, thanks again for your note (including the "sappy stuff" -- sappy
or not, it's always good to hear). I get the feeling we're pretty much on the
same page; now we just need to make it all happen. My moves for the spring
will look a lot like last fall's moves. I'm clearly in defense mode until
something starts to give in Italy's position. If you have any specific
suggestion, your thoughts are always welcome. Very best of luck to you in
your Mediterranean endeavors; the Turkish people will be cheering every French
advance.
Best regards,
Ali
Message from Turkey to England
Ivy,
I certainly share your hope that France goes after Italy full-force. As you
can imagine, I was quite delighted to see F Marseilles. Hopefully, Italy will
soon start to crumble with pressure from both sides. I owe you a great debt
for making it all possible, especially your sacrifice of Bel. I have of
course been encouraging Russia to support you to Denmark. Germany will not
stand long in the face of F/E/R pressure.
In terms of long-range planning, I have to confess I've not got a clear
picture of what the game will look like. The immediate goal of paring down
Italy will take some time, and it's hard to say how it will come about. Italy
might throw all his efforts against either me or France, leaving the other to
reap the rewards; or he might defend equally against both, in which case gains
will continue to be difficult. I am pleased to see you and Russia working
together, but at the same time I fear what Russia will do once he's stronger.
I have no doubt that he still bears me some grudges for my earlier
transgressions.
Roberto wrote to me just after the move result, asking me to disband F Smy and
promising to throw everything against France if I did. Naturally, I declined
his generous offer. He then wrote to say his offer of support was withdrawn
and would be offered to "another power". The most likely candidate is
probably Germany. Active cooperation between Italy and Germany would, of
course, not be good for any of us. But in the long run, I can't see how they
could possibly prevail against the rest of us -- as long as E/F/T/R continue
to work together, that is.
In any case, nothing has changed my belief that what is good for England, is
good for Turkey, and vice-versa. I hope you will be able to build a strong
position out of Germany's demise, while I eventually get an opportunity to pay
Italy back. After that... well, it's too difficult for me to predict what the
game will look like. But as long as we can keep our forces viable, and as
long as we continue to maintain strong ties, then I'm sure we'll both be able
to benefit from whatever opportunities present themselves.
Best of luck to you in the result, and if there's anything I can do, please
let me know.
Best regards,
Ali
Message from Turkey to England and France
Gentlemen,
I'm just writing to express my sincere thanks and continued support for your
renewed spirit of cooperation. I hope and expect that as events unfold, the
two of you will enjoy a strong and mutually beneficial alliance. I recall the
situation just a year ago, when I first wrote to encourage your cease-fire.
The board I see before me now is more promising than I had dared hope. Italy
remains a real threat, and he won't be easy to take down. But the odds are on
our side, and the situation is far, far more promising now. Again, thank you.
Best regards to you both,
Ali
Message from Turkey to Master
France's EOY for 1905
Despite losing a center and having to disband, 1905 actually went about as
well as could be expected after Italy's stab. I put a great deal of effort in
the Spring diplomacy phase aimed at getting England and France to cease their
hostilities and begin working together. I don't know if that was the turning
point or not, but whatever the reasons, EF did indeed seem to put their
differences aside, and France is now poised to give Italy some real problems.
Were it not for that, I'd be heading for a quick exit from the game.
Unfortunately the long-term scenario isn't really all that favorable to
Turkey. Even with a full-on French effort against Italy, it will take some
time to get Italy beat down, and it's really difficult to predict what the
game will look like after that. If England and Russia continue their
cooperation, I think Germany will start to erode pretty quickly, unless France
comes into the fight on Germany's side. Which would be a bad thing from my
perspective, as it would detract from France's ability to fight Italy. But if
Germany goes down fast, Russia is sure to regrow; and Russia, I think, holds
little love in his heart for the Turkish regime.
But part of the reason I chose Turkey in the first place is its traditionally
good defensive geography. I'm clearly not out of the woods yet, and if Italy
continues to devote the bulk of his efforts against me, there's still a chance
I might not hold even this year. But if he turns to counterattack France,
then there is a chance I can start to regrow. I expect there's a good
likelihood that Italy and Germany will begin cooperating; but if E/F/T/R
continue cooperation, then the odds are in my favor.
So all in all, I have the sense that I'm on the right side of the balance of
power in the game as it stands today. But that assumes that the current
political structures continue to hold, and that's certainly not how the game
has gone so far. The main thing working in my favor, ironically, is probably
the strong Italian position. As long as he remains so dominant, he attracts a
lot of attention. My goal for the year is to simply hang on, try to keep EFTR
all on the same side, and if possible take at least one center from Italy. I
feel encouraged about the coming year... but I remain far from confident.
Message from England to Turkey
Ali,
Interesting message from Italy. I am going to break one of my own
principles and give you his message in full and my response in full.
************
First Italy's message:
Message from Italy to England in 'titleist':
>
> My moves are in and, once again, I am doing what France
> requests. [That was me (Ivy) talking]
>
Good, nothing more I'd like to see than France prosper. [Roberto replying]
> My goal is not the destruction of Italy,
Odd since that is my goal. I offered up my centers to Turkey but he refused
so now I've offered them up to France. We'll see if he accepts or not.
> Once it is clear that the game is balanced again,
I really don't see how the game will ever become balanced again. Once the
balance of power shifts over to France with a weak or non-existant Germany,
whom do you expect to stop France? It won't be Italy. I'd just assume this
game be over. It might be bad sportsmanship but quite honestly I'm not in
the mood to play this game anymore. Here's hoping France takes me up on my
offer.
Roberto
**************
Here was my reply:
Roberto,
> quite honestly I'm not in the mood to play this game anymore.
This is more than understandable, given all that has transpired.
>It might be bad sportsmanship but ...
I am not convinced that we are about to witness any bad sportsmanship; we
all have too much respect for each other. So I must conclude that you are
trying to influence my stance. Why not?
I don't believe you expect me to attack France in order to preserve Italian
superiority. I do believe that you should expect me to attack France to
prevent French superiority and to preserve an Italy who could help me do it.
> Once the balance of power shifts over to France ...
I don't want France to have a dominant position any more than I wanted
Italy to have a dominant position. Perhaps I may misjudge what it takes to
control France or when to do it, but I will be watching and thinking. You
might ask how I expect you to help against France if you are weakened and
besieged by Turkey in the rear. For starters, I talk to Turkey and request
that he desist any attack against you. Am I naive? I don't think so. Not
with the players in this particular game. Not with this Turkey.
I was about to be squashed by France and Germany when the world realized
that something had to be done about Italy. The same should happen if
something needs to be done about France.
Hang tough.
Most courteously,
Ivy
***************
Who knows, Ali, what Italy will really do, but we do need to be alert to
the possibility that France could prosper disproportionately. So we watch.
Ivy
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
Well have you any thoughts, or are we dead in the water? Is my one fleet of
such great political import that it means everything to you, or do we have any
basis for talk?
I will be continuing my efforts of last year, which is simply to defend
myself. I realize you may not have a great interest in the game right now.
Indeed, my own has waned as well. But I would like to continue to try and
survive if possible.
As I said, I don't think it's unreasonable for me to ask that you take the
first step. I think if you look at things objectively you'll come to the same
conclusion. Put yourself in my shoes; would you really have disbanded the
fleet? Is there some logical reason why this was a do-or-die request on your
part?
I continue to welcome any discussion, and I hope you will reply.
Ali
Message from Turkey to England
Ivy,
Interesting information from Italy. He certainly seems pretty disenchanted.
I have written again to Roberto to try and get some kind of discussion going
(without, of course, giving any indication that I was aware of your exchange).
Why he is so hung up on whether or not I disbanded the fleet, I do not
understand. Certainly my lone fleet doesn't provide nearly the threat to him
that France's 4 fleets do. He can hardly blame me for our conflict, since he
was the one who attacked me. Twice.
In any case, we will have to keep an eye on events. Even if Italy throws
centers to France, ultimately Italy will become so weakened that I'll have
some opportunities of my own; but we don't want an unstoppable France any more
than an unstoppable Italy. Of course, the Italian press could just be a
diplomatic maneuver, and may not be true; but my gut reaction in reading it
was that he means what he said.
Long-term, the prospect of France getting overheated makes Russia that much
more of a factor. If Italy stays 100% against me, then Russian intentions
could really make or break my position. Likewise, France and Russia both
being strong does not work well for England.
I'm certainly not proposing any change in course, far from it. But I hope
that as you and Russia cooperate against Germany, that you can use your
diplomatic prowess to keep Russia somewhat in line.
Thanks again for the information.
Ali
Message from England to Turkey
Ali,
>I'm certainly not proposing any change in course, far from it. But I hope
>that as you and Russia cooperate against Germany, that you can use your
>diplomatic prowess to keep Russia somewhat in line.
Meaning that I should encourage him to attack me after Germany is dead,
rather than attack you?
[Just joking.]
I've been hoping that you and I could hit Russia as Germany was dying or
dead, before Russia decides to team with France against me or Italy against
you.
All this speculation is probably futile. We just need to await actual
developments.
I do admit that I was not fond of Italy's tone.
Ivy
Message from Turkey to England
Ivy,
> Meaning that I should encourage him to attack me after Germany is dead,
> rather than attack you?
> [Just joking.]
Heh heh, not at all. I was thinking more in terms of directing him toward
Austria and focusing on the center... rather than on regaining Sev and
focusing to the south.
I've been thinking about what Italian centers make the most sense for me to
attack, if and when the time comes that I might gain anything at all. I've
been thinking more in terms of Gre/Ser than Austria proper -- precisely for
this reason.
> I've been hoping that you and I could hit Russia as Germany was dying or
> dead, before Russia decides to team with France against me or Italy against
> you.
This certainly sounds good to me... let's hope it works out that way.
> All this speculation is probably futile. We just need to await actual
> developments.
All too true, unfortunately.
> I do admit that I was not fond of Italy's tone.
It was interesting, wasn't it? What do you make of it? Any speculation about
what potential causes might be?
Ali
Message from France to Turkey
Ali:
I have no problems with your helping Germany against
Italy. Just do not help him against Russia. We need
Russia for now. I also want to repeat that we should try
to balance England and Russia. A sign of good faith
between us and necessary to better work toward a path
where Turkey and France dominate and we do not have a
third large party in the way.
Good luck.
--Prince Boar
Message from Italy to Turkey
>
> Well have you any thoughts, or are we dead in the water?
>
No pun intended I'm sure.
> Is there some logical reason why this was a do-or-die
> request on your part?
>
Of course not, but you're not dealing with the same logical individual you
were at the start of the game.
> I continue to welcome any discussion, and I hope you will reply.
>
I suppose this qualifies as a reply although not much of a discussion.
Apparently an offer of complete withdrawal from the Balkans as well as two
of my centers didn't qualify as a 'first step'; thus, I'm going to have to
ask you to make the first step and tell me what you want from me assuming of
course you want to continue this discussion.
Roberto
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
> Of course not, but you're not dealing with the same logical individual you
> were at the start of the game.
Then I will look to you to enlighten me as to who I am dealing with. I
understand your enthusiasm for the game has diminished, if not vanished
entirely; but I have not yet grasped what is motivating you at this point,
which of course is the first necessity in any negotiation.
> Apparently an offer of complete withdrawal from the Balkans as well as two
> of my centers didn't qualify as a 'first step'; thus, I'm going to have to
> ask you to make the first step and tell me what you want from me assuming of
> course you want to continue this discussion.
I guess I ought to clarify what I meant by "first step". Apparently I
misinterpreted your press; I'll have to go back and re-read it, but I guess I
took it as more theoretical than hard promises. Also, I'm back to "once
bitten, twice shy" mode when it comes to promises anyway, and I felt you were
expecting me to take the first actual step -- in terms of game results --
which I wasn't really ready for at the time. That's what I meant by "first
step."
If we can reach some agreement to resume relations, I'm certainly willing to
take it slowly. Even if you abandoned the Balkans entirely, I wouldn't grab
at centers willy-nilly. I would prefer a one-at-a-time transition. As you
know from before, I've always had an emphasis on stability, and I haven't lost
that desire.
As I may have said before, my moves will be similar to my last fall move,
though perhaps not identical. Which is to say, they will be purely defensive.
If you continue attacking me, I fear we won't have much to discuss. If
instead your orders reflect a release of pressure against Turkey, then I would
certainly want a constructive dialogue so that we can proceed gracefully.
But the bottom line is, I'm still searching to better understand your motives.
On one hand, you implied that you have lost much of your interest in the game.
But on the other, you seem to be taking a hard-line reaction to my not
disbanding my fleet, despite the fact that I *still* have not attacked any
Italian-controlled province yet in the game, and have only been responding to
events controlled by Italy.
In any case, yes, I do very much want to continue this discussion.
Ali
England: Fleet English Channel CONVOY Army Picardy → Holland
England: Fleet North Sea CONVOY Army Picardy → Holland
England: Fleet Norway → St Petersburg (north coast)
England: Army Picardy → English Channel → North Sea → Holland
France: Army Belgium SUPPORT English Army Picardy → Holland
France: Army Burgundy → Munich (*bounce*)
France: Fleet Marseilles → Gulf of Lyon
France: Fleet Mid-Atlantic Ocean → North Africa
France: Fleet Spain (south coast) → Western Mediterranean
France: Fleet Western Mediterranean → Tunis
Germany: Fleet Denmark → North Sea (*bounce*)
Germany: Army Holland SUPPORT French Army Belgium (*cut, dislodged*)
Germany: Army Livonia → Prussia
Germany: Army Munich → Silesia
Germany: Fleet St Petersburg (south coast) → Gulf of Bothnia
Germany: Army Tyrolia → Munich (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Aegean Sea → Constantinople (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Apulia → Ionian Sea
Italy: Army Budapest → Galicia (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Greece → Bulgaria (south coast) (*bounce*)
Italy: Army Serbia SUPPORT Fleet Greece → Bulgaria (south coast)
Italy: Army Trieste → Vienna
Italy: Fleet Tyrrhenian Sea → Rome
Italy: Army Venice → Tyrolia (*bounce*)
Italy: Army Vienna → Bohemia
Russia: Army Moscow → Livonia
Russia: Fleet Sweden → Denmark (*bounce*)
Russia: Army Warsaw SUPPORT Army Moscow → Livonia
Turkey: Fleet Black Sea SUPPORT Army Bulgaria
Turkey: Army Bulgaria SUPPORT Army Sevastopol → Rumania (*cut*)
Turkey: Army Constantinople SUPPORT Army Bulgaria (*cut*)
Turkey: Army Galicia SUPPORT Army Sevastopol → Rumania (*cut*)
Turkey: Army Sevastopol → Rumania
Turkey: Fleet Smyrna → Aegean Sea (*bounce*)
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