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Italy: Builds 2 units
Turkey: Builds 1 unit
Message from England to all
Hats off to Austria, for he is one of us.
Most of the rest of us will be joining you in good time, my friend.
Ivy Wingo
Message from England to Turkey
Ali,
Hope you had a nice holiday.
That's the first time that Italy ever lied to me. It seemed so unnecessary
from my vantage point. The west would not have looked much different had
he been honest.
Perhaps he lied to me in order to cover lies to you? Were you especting
Italy in the Aegean or in Serbia?
Drop me a line when you get back.
As always,
Ivy
Message from Austria to all
> Most of the rest of us will be joining you in good time, my friend.
The Archduke fled the capital, and escaped in the confusion; from time to
time, I will pass on his messages and comments. At the moment, he is still
trying to familiarize himself with his new accomodations.
Miranda, for Austria-Hungary, by the Grace of Archduke Ferdinand
Message from France to Turkey
Ali:
I can help but think that you were betrayed yet again by
Italy. I would like to be able to help you again, but I
need something to break between Germany and England. If
you can help me convince either of them to join me
against the other, I would sooner be able to help you.
If they stick together, then I will be forced to try and
stonewall them, which will delay any help coming your
way.
--Prince Boar
PS: You absolutely must build a fleet, don't you think.
Can you make pease with Russia?
Message from France to all
France wishes the Best to Archduke Ferdinand.
May he enjoy his retirement. We shall be thinking of
him.
Also please give our best to Felicia. We enjoyed our
conversations with her.
--Prince Boar
Message from England to Turkey
Ali,
A little more reflection makes it obvious to me that Italy is indeed
attacking you. It seems to me that we both need Germany more than ever
now. Certainly, Germany could help reduce the Russia/Italy pressure
against you.
Germany needs to believe that we now have EGT vs IFR. Thus, he has to be
convinced that if he and France jointly attack me, then France will
continute northward and attack Germany in turn with Italian help. In
particular, it stands to reason France will not be attacking Italy after
all Italy has just done for him.
I would think that Germany might be open to GT cooperation against Russia.
Let me know if you have any bright ideas. I will be OK for some time if
Germany stands with me. You are going to have rough going against Italy if
no one can come to your rescue.
The worst scenario would be GF vs E and RI vs T.
At least we will not finish 7th !
Ivy
Message from Germany to Turkey
Ali:
How many times are you going to let Italy stab you?
Ivy has suggested that we combine our forces and finish off Russia.
That seems like a good plan to me. However, it's my opinion that you're
still working with Nick. Do you have units to spare on a northern
campaign, and is that the way that you wish to go?
Fredd
Message from Italy to Turkey
I suppose an explanation is in order.
I changed my orders at the last moment prior to the deadline after a full
hour of analyzing the consequences of taking Spain. In my mind, it would
not have been the correct move. I realize that you are still very powerful
and it will be extremely difficult to break thru your defenses. You have
many diplomatic options available to you as I made the moves on my own
accord without promises from any other power. I do not expect or anticipate
any help.
I know you'll probably spend the rest of the game attempting to wreck havoc
on the Italian empire. I don't blame you and would do the same if in your
shoes.
Roberto
Message from Russia to Turkey
Ali,
I'm curious, who first proposed that you remain
in Sev? I would appreciate an honest answer. While
your repeated failure to support/allow me to gain
Centers will make it difficult for me to trust you
enough to work closely with you, this doesn't rule
out you moving toward Italy, and allowing me to
retake Sev as you recapture Serbia. Even something
as small as that could be the foundation for future
cooperation. I hope you will consider that possibility,
and honestly answer my question.
Sincerely,
Czar Nicholas II.
Message from Germany to Turkey
Ali:
It's my belief that Italy can run over you (eventually) unless you get
some help.
This is not part of my plan for the German victory.
Unfortunately, I can't send any units south this turn.
There is however another way to add two units to your arsenal
immediately. They are sitting in WAR and UKR.
I've made an offer to Russia that I'll leave WAR and MOS alone if
he'll
give up STP. (Which doesn't matter really as his fleet there can't do
anything anyway)
You might want to offer him some builds if he'll help you out.
I can send a unit to TYR in the fall. I'm sure that it'll be too late
then.
Fredd
Message from Turkey to Russia
Nick,
I realize you have no reason to believe a word I say, but here is the
absolute truth. Throughout last week, I pushed hard to get me into Bud and
return Sev to you. Italy gave it lip service, to both of us, but he
*never*
said "I have entered vie s ser-bud" or any such, despite my pressing him
for
a concrete answer. He said the matter would be decided on Thursday, and of
course on Thursday the judge was down.
Throughout the diplomacy phase, I had extensive discussions with Ivy about
my reasons for wanting to keep you alive, my argument being that a viable
Russia would be good for him against Germany. I specifically said that I
didn't want to burn any bridges with you this year, and urged him to
contact
you to get the ball rolling on ER cooperation. I made detailed suggestions
of how he could turn to attack Germany, either by cooperating with Italy or
with France, but in any case with Russia harrying German flanks.
Friday morning, with the deadline passed, there was a flurry of diplomacy
between me, Roberto and Ivy, including joint press from E to IT and from I
to ET. The jist of it was that EI would at last cooperate agaisnt France.
The plan was for Ivy to withdraw from MAO (hence MAO-IRI), thereby allowing
WMS-Spa/sc. I was included in the discussion because Roberto claimed he'd
need my permission since that would mean he might be building 3. Of
course,
I found the idea that Italy would build 3 units alarming, since one of the
main tenents of our relationship has been that we would grow at the same
rate, my preference being one unit a year (which was another reason I was
pushing for Austria to be split evenly among us).
Anyway, at the last I was able to get Roberto to agree to support me to
Bud,
though I remained very leery of it all. I stayed in Sev so that if Roberto
stabbed me (which it turns out he did) I would at least have one build to
match his potential 3. Very short-sighted, but that's how you tend to be
when you're second-guessing everything at the last minute (in this case,
with an expired deadline). Then just when Roberto got his order in, the
deadline was extended. After that, I did not receive any further
discussion
of moves from anyone, and I left on vacation that afternoon without seeing
the result.
So the bottom line is that I argued strongly in favor of splitting Austria
between ITR, to both Italy and England. I argued for stability and
flexibility, and until Friday morning, meaning, until after the deadline,
my
order was Bla S Sev-Rum. If nobody had been late, that would have been my
order for the turn. But it seems stability and flexibility weren't what
Roberto had in mind. Once again, he played me like a violin, and it seems
Ivy as well.
As for who actually suggested I stay in Sev first, I can't honestly
remember. I will say that at one point on Friday, Roberto suggested that I
not only stay in Sev, but attack Moscow as well, despite the fact that I
would have exposed Smy to attack from Austria (Con/Gre were to bounce in
Bul). And indeed, it's curious that Austria did in fact attack Smyrna. I
wonder if Austria's been receiving any more grey press.
Roberto must be feeling pretty confident if the feels he can make fools of
both England and Turkey in the same move. If the game now turns into an
IFG
end game, then he may well turn out to be right, and as it stands my
money's
on Italy to win the game. But the face of this game seems to change every
year, so he may not get the last laugh.
As for the coming turn, I pretty much plan to fall back and regroup for
some
kind of defense. I figure I'll lose Bud to Italy, and Sev to you.
Hopefully not more than that. So it will be pretty much up to you whether
Turkey lives or not. If you pressure me from Sev, then I'll crumble fast.
If you choose to let me live, then RT would clearly have the upper hand,
since Germany has left a power vacuum in the center. If IFG emerges, and
you side with Italy, then you'll probably survive me in the game; but
probably not by much.
If you have *any* suggestions as to my coming build and Spring moves, I
would welcome them. A fleet build seems both obvious and futile, but
nevertheless that's what I've ordered. In the spring, I cannot decide if
it
would be better to try and force F Bul into Con, or move it back to Bla to
defend Con/Bul. Any desires Russia has in the matter would be most
welcome.
Ali
Message from Russia to Turkey
Ali,
As I see it, you have to focus on defending against
Italy, so I don't see you as a threat. Germany, in
spite of his withdrawl, remains a threat, especially
since he's likely to ally with France against England,
and send an Army east again. I think, therefore, that
I have to move to Ukr-Mos, and "encourage" GA Lvn to
head west. This is likely to make it impossible for
me to take Sev this year, even if you move Sev-Rum this
Spring. F Smy seems like a necessary build for you at
this point, especially since you're almost certain to
see F Nap-Ion this Spring.
Nick.
Message from Master to all
Okay, I think my email is back. I got nothing in or out of
masseyd@btv.ibm.com for four or five days, then I got a flood
of about 300 mails in the last hour (in reverse chronological
order, for some reason).
Anyway, everything seems to be back to normal on my end.
I think we have everyone back from Labor Day vacation in the
U.S. and are ready to continue with the F1904B deadline
tonight.
Doug
Message from France to Turkey
Ali:
I trust that your trip was pleasant, even if the movement
results were not.
I expect that you are building a fleet. If you need to
bounce any ideas or talk through some issues, let me
know.
I will try to influence Germany and Russia where I can.
Italy seems to have made up us mind. I run a delicate
balance. I do not want him to focus all his attention on
me. But I also do not want him to crush you. I hope
that you can outplay him in the tactical and alliance
fields.
--Prince Boar
Message from Turkey to Germany
Fredd,
Good to hear from you. Indeed, it seems I'll need to make amends with
Russia, since IR cooperation right now would kill me quickly. That will
mean giving him Sev. If that appeases him, and you don't attack him, then
he and I could probably gain the upper hand against Italy, though it would
take a while and Russia would surely prosper from it. Or, Russia might
attack me anyway, in which case he'll still grow, and Italy will become fat
from my carcass.
Italy has not a single threat on the board, and is already the largest
power. I had hoped I could at least keep up, but it was not to be, and I'll
probably end the year at 4 or 5 units. Unless *somebody* else attacks him,
he'll have gained most of the south by the time the western triangle is
resolved. If you can get into Tyr, that would be great, but Italy's already
shown a strong desire to control the center of the board, and I fully expect
A Ven, so it may take more than that to turn the tide. [Don't get me wrong:
any help at all would, obviously, be more than welcome.]
The current board position looks like the makings of an IFG, which would
essentially mean FG vs. E, IR vs. T. That's going to mean you'll need to
build fleets to (a) attack England, and (b) defend against all the French
fleets that will be on your border once England is gone. France may turn
against Italy, but so far they seem rather joined at the hip, do they not?
That in turn means you may be army-weak in a period where Russia may have
grown from gains against Turkey. Whatever you decide, I strongly urge you
to seriously consider these ramifications.
In any case, the one thing I really want from you is a little more press.
;^) I certainly understand your desire to keep your cards close to the
vest, and I definitely urge you to do exactly that in your dealings with
Italy. He has already shown a strong tendency to stab based on his
foreknowledge of his ally's moves; he's done that 3 times already in the
game. So by all means, I urge you not to let Roberto in on your moves any
more than is absolutely necessary. But that said, I don't think it's unfair
to ask for some notion of what German goals and intentions are, and I have
always wished for greater communication between us.
Regards,
Ali
Message from Turkey to England
Ivy,
Yes, you can bet that was a genuine Italian attack. Gre/Bla were supposed
to bounce in Bul, and Roberto specifically told me at the end of that
flurry
of negotiations, "I have ordered Vie S Tri, Tri S Ser-Bud." So, that was
certainly not the result I had hoped for. Roberto must be feeling pretty
damned confident if he feels he can screw over England and Turkey in the
same turn. If the game turns into IFG, he may be right.
Germany has written me twice since the deadline, with conflicting
suggestions. First he proposed GT efforts against Russia. Then he said he
might cut a deal with Russia, that he would leave Mos/War alone if Russia
gave up StP, and urged me to instead try and get Russia on my side. Either
way, I will be strongly urging Germany to stick with England. It won't be
hard to make the argument that if he joins France now, he'll have French
fleets all over him afterwards, since I do believe this to be the case.
Anyway, I don't think I have much choice other than to try and make amends
with Russia at this point, especially if Germany doesn't commit any centers
to the south. I have written Russia with a description of the events of
last turn. I will also copy it in joint press to you and him, asking for
your confirmation. I feel I've given an honest and accurate description;
if
you disagee with any of it, then please feel free to say so. But to those
elements that you know to be true, I hope you will confirm to Russia. It's
about the only chance I have of keeping Russia from being an Italian
janissary.
In any case, if Russia sides with Italy then I won't last long. I'm sure
to
lose Bud to Italy at the least, and I'll have to withdraw from Sev if I'm
going to have any chance of mending fences with Russia. Given that Italy
has literally no threats on the board, IR cooperation would mean a quick
death for Turkey.
As always, any thoughts you might have would be most welcome.
Ali
Message from Turkey to England and Russia
Gentlemen,
Below is an excerpt of my recent press to Russia, describing the events of
the last turn. Ivy, I ask you to answer honestly: do you agree that my
description is accurate, at least in terms of those elements of which you
had direct knowledge?
Ali
----- Original Message -----
> Nick,
>
> I realize you have no reason to believe a word I say, but here is the
> absolute truth. Throughout last week, I pushed hard to get me into Bud
and
> return Sev to you. Italy gave it lip service, to both of us, but he
*never*
> said "I have entered vie s ser-bud" or any such, despite my pressing him
for
> a concrete answer. He said the matter would be decided on Thursday, and
of
> course on Thursday the judge was down.
>
> Throughout the diplomacy phase, I had extensive discussions with Ivy
about
> my reasons for wanting to keep you alive, my argument being that a viable
> Russia would be good for him against Germany. I specifically said that I
> didn't want to burn any bridges with you this year, and urged him to
contact
> you to get the ball rolling on ER cooperation. I made detailed
suggestions
> of how he could turn to attack Germany, either by cooperating with Italy
or
> with France, but in any case with Russia harrying German flanks.
>
> Friday morning, with the deadline passed, there was a flurry of diplomacy
> between me, Roberto and Ivy, including joint press from E to IT and from
I
> to ET. The jist of it was that EI would at last cooperate agaisnt
France.
> The plan was for Ivy to withdraw from MAO (hence MAO-IRI), thereby
allowing
> WMS-Spa/sc. I was included in the discussion because Roberto claimed
he'd
> need my permission since that would mean he might be building 3. Of
course,
> I found the idea that Italy would build 3 units alarming, since one of
the
> main tenents of our relationship has been that we would grow at the same
> rate, my preference being one unit a year (which was another reason I was
> pushing for Austria to be split evenly among us).
>
> Anyway, at the last I was able to get Roberto to agree to support me to
Bud,
> though I remained very leery of it all. I stayed in Sev so that if
Roberto
> stabbed me (which it turns out he did) I would at least have one build to
> match his potential 3. Very short-sighted, but that's how you tend to be
> when you're second-guessing everything at the last minute (in this case,
> with an expired deadline). Then just when Roberto got his order in, the
> deadline was extended. After that, I did not receive any further
discussion
> of moves from anyone, and I left on vacation that afternoon without
seeing
> the result.
>
> So the bottom line is that I argued strongly in favor of splitting
Austria
> between ITR, to both Italy and England. I argued for stability and
> flexibility, and until Friday morning, meaning, until after the deadline,
my
> order was Bla S Sev-Rum. If nobody had been late, that would have been
my
> order for the turn. But it seems stability and flexibility weren't what
> Roberto had in mind. Once again, he played me like a violin, and it
seems
> Ivy as well.
Message from Turkey to Russia
Nick,
Obviously, if you didn't take Sev this year it would be a godsend. It
probably makes sense for me to withdraw from it anyway, to shore up my
defenses in Turkey.
How would this set of moves work for you: F Smy-Aeg, Bul-Bla, Con S Rum-Bul,
Sev S Bud-Rum, Arm-Ank, thereby allowing Sev-Arm in the fall. I don't think
I can move Sev through Rum, and Arm provides stronger defense at home.
Again, if you have any wishes, desires, suggestions, or whatever, please
don't hesitate to write.
Ali
Message from Turkey to Russia
Nick,
> How would this set of moves work for you: F Smy-Aeg, Bul-Bla, Con S
Rum-Bul,
> Sev S Bud-Rum, Arm-Ank, thereby allowing Sev-Arm in the fall. I don't
think
> I can move Sev through Rum, and Arm provides stronger defense at home.
To clarify: I'm proposing moving out of Sev in the fall not as a delaying
action, but in order to support Bud-Rum. If this is not acceptable to you,
then say the word and I'll move out in spring.
Or, if you have any other moves you would prefer, don't hesitate.
Ali
Message from Turkey to Master
Turkey's EOY for 1904
Well, that was an ugly surprise, though I suppose I should have seen it
coming. Actually I did see it coming, but I thought it was further off.
During the last-minute presses on Friday morning, it dawned on me that
"Roberto" really uses foreknowledge of his allies' moves to make effective
stabs. Nothing new, certainly, but he's done it every year since 1902! So
I figured that would be how he stabbed me, though I really did think he
would stick it to France this time around.
The year started well enough, with the destruction of the Austrian army and
Italy's strong move to the center. When it came to discussing the ultimate
disposition of Austrian units, though, it became pretty clear that neither
of us really wanted the other to have Budapest. I wanted him attacking
France, and he wanted me attacking Russia, for much the same reasons.
The result I was most comfortable with was an equal division of Austrian
centers between ITR. I knew in my gut that I didn't want to add insult to
injury where Russia was concerned, and that I could make some real brownie
points by giving him Sev. I tried to get support for the idea from both
Italy and England, on the premise that my attacking Russia would ultimately
benefit Germany. Roberto claims he would have gone along with it, but my
guess is that he was planning to stab me this turn no matter what I did. In
any case, neither Italy nor England showed any enthusiasm for keeping Russia
alive.
In truth, I did consider stabbing Russia by staying in Sev, and even
attacking into Mos, but I was never comfortable with those options.
Attacking Mos meant leaving Smy vacant, which would have been a hell of a
gamble (and, in the end, would have put Austria in Smy). Simply remaining
in Sev was undesirable, especially if it meant Italy building two. So I
entered orders to vacate Sev as promised, relying on Italian support for
Bud.
Italy and I were supposed to work out the final arrangements on Thursday,
but the judge was down. Friday morning, I wrote frantically to determine
Italian intentions. That was when the press started flying with England and
Italy. The plan developed that England would vacate MAO, thereby allowing
Italy to take Spain. Of course, I was aghast at the notion that Italy would
gain Spa, Vie, Bud, while my only option for growth was to stay in Sev.
But Italy quickly agreed to my proposal that he take Spa, Vie while I took
Bud, Sev. He did an awesome job of telling me just what I wanted to hear,
leading me by the nose into doing exactly what he wanted me to. I bought it
hook, line and sinker, and committed the worst sin for Turkey: I got greedy.
"Be patient as Turkey," I read long ago, and it's a credo that's served me
well. Too bad I forgot it in the frenzy on Friday morning.
Of course, there is at least an outside chance that had the deadline not
been extended, then Italy might have actually stabbed France and not
attacked me. The whole issue of the judge being up and down was
unfortunate, but after all it's always been a factor in judge play. As is
the frantic last-minute negotiating after a deadline. I hope that when the
game is over, I'll find an anwer to that question.
Looking ahead, I really don't have many options. I need to get into turtle
mode, and try to stay alive as long as possible. If Russia doesn't attack
me, I may hold out for a while. If he attacks Italy, we would come out on
top, but I'm not expecting it. If he joins Italy against me, I'll probably
be the first to join Austria in exile. At this point it looks like an IFG
end game; but the face of this game has changed so many times already,
nothing is certain. Perhaps if I hold out long enough, some opportunity
will arise.
Message from Russia to Turkey
>Message from Turkey to Russia in 'titleist':
>I'm proposing moving out of Sev in the fall not as a delaying action, but
>in order to support Bud-Rum. If this is not acceptable to you, then say
>the word and I'll move out in spring.
At this point, I see no reason to tell you how
to move. My short-term goal is to get GA Lvn out of
Russia without losing StP. As I see it, you need to
defend against, or counter-attack, Italy, so moving
out of Sev to the south or west seems a reasonable
course to take. If you do that, I'll consider
working with you to stop Italy, if circumstances
permit.
Without a great deal of study, I would say that
Sev-Rum, with Bud retreating to Gal would probably
make more sense than Bud-Rum, since it threatens an
attempt to retake Bud, and gives you greater options,
but it's your country to defend.
Nick.
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
> I changed my orders at the last moment prior to the deadline after a full
> hour of analyzing the consequences of taking Spain. In my mind, it would
> not have been the correct move.
I would love to hear the results of that analysis. Was it truly the
long-term consequences that decided you, or just the opportunity for a
really good stab? Or did you plan to stab me this year no matter what I
did?
I once again find myself writing to congratulate you on your ability to
blind-side me. And I again find myself asking, was there anything I could
have done differently to retain Italy as an ally?
> I realize that you are still very powerful
> and it will be extremely difficult to break thru your defenses. You have
> many diplomatic options available to you as I made the moves on my own
> accord without promises from any other power. I do not expect or
anticipate
> any help.
You won't need any help. Breaking through my defenses is only a matter of
time. I cannot hold against you in Austria or the Balkans, and as I remove
units I will quickly be reduced to my home centers, and will soon thereafter
lose even those.
In the meantime, you have not a single threat on the board. A very juicy
position, and one that's already caught a lot of attention. But any
"diplomatic options" I might have are useless if they don't translate to
action on the board.
> I know you'll probably spend the rest of the game attempting to wreck
havoc
> on the Italian empire. I don't blame you and would do the same if in your
> shoes.
I will spend the rest of the game trying to build Turkey. At the moment, my
prospects aren't good, and you're clearly my enemy. Be that as it may, I am
not a grudge player, as you've already learned in this game. If at some
point you choose to end your hostilities, my diplomatic channels will remain
open.
Ali
Message from Turkey to Austria
Archduke,
I'm curious to know just how effective Italy's stab really was. Were your
moves suggested by him, or by grey press? Even if you don't reply to me, I
hope you'll mention it in your EOY.
Looks like I'll soon be joining you in exile. Save some space for me.
Regards,
Ali
Message from Master to Austria, England, France, Germany, Italy, Russia, and Turkey
Just signing on to encourage End Of Year statements from the players,
especially from Austria (who I think mentioned that he'd be forthcoming
with one soon, anyway).
Thank you for playing Austria; I hope you'll stay on as an observer.
Feel free to continue to affect play in a verbal manner, if you wish.
Doug
Message from Italy to Turkey
>
> I would love to hear the results of that analysis. Was it truly the
> long-term consequences that decided you, or just the opportunity for
> a really good stab? Or did you plan to stab me this year no matter
> what I did?
>
I did not plan to stab you this year, until about 15 minutes prior to the
deadline. I will say though, it was stab you now or probably never have the
chance again.
I'll try my best to re-create my analysis but must admit that most of it is
difficult to describe in words.
First, it hinged on a couple of assumptions.
1) Germany would be successful against Russia namely Sil-War allowing
Lvn-Stp to succeed or, even worse for Russia as it turns out, Lvn-Mos and
Gob-STP. The weaker Russia is, the easier and faster for you to take
MOS/WAR and turn your attention my direction.
2) I'm still not confident that Ivy is sincere in his desire to attack
France. He has, since the beginning of the game, tried to lure me into a
fight with France. I have my doubts he'd follow thru if I started. At this
point in the game, I don't think it would be to his advantage. Thus, I
feared I'd have to defend against French counter-attacks without any help
from either England or Germany. I am supremely confident that, even if I
did attack France, England would not allow my entrance into the MAO thus
limiting my gains to no more than Spain and Marseilles.
Tactically, I determined WMS-Spa to be just flat out a bad move. I had no
way of defending it so I would lose it back to France next year. The best I
could hope for was to trade it for Marseilles. But, I'd still have to build
fleets and move them west to block the West Med since France would most
assuredly remove an army and not one of his fleets. That leaves me with two
armies and a fleet (Tri,Vie,Gre) as defense against a Turkish stab. I felt
utterly mystified how I could possibly defend against your next two builds
AND fend off France.
I think if you set the board up and move the pieces and then take a look at
the game from an Italian perspective, you'll understand much better than me
trying desparately to describe it.
> I once again find myself writing to congratulate you on your
> ability to blind-side me. And I again find myself asking, was
> there anything I could have done differently to retain Italy
> as an ally?
>
Allowing Russia to re-capture his home centers. I think that would have
forced me to remain allied with you since Russia would be strong enough to
assist you against me.
>
> In the meantime, you have not a single threat on the board.
> A very juicy position, and one that's already caught a lot
> of attention.
>
I have heard from all of the Western powers and each one is concerned about
my, as one person termed it, '300 lb gorilla' size. They too see the threat
of Italy's size. It would not surprise me to see France turn his attention
my way as opposed to continuing his revenge tactics towards England.
Life is Beautiful,
Roberto
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
> I did not plan to stab you this year, until about 15 minutes prior to the
> deadline.
So you're saying that if the deadline hadn't been extended, you really would
have attacked France? You really know how to hurt a guy.
> I will say though, it was stab you now or probably never have the
> chance again.
And here I was worried about you stabbing me when I had my armies out of
position in Russia.
> I'll try my best to re-create my analysis but must admit that most of it
is
> difficult to describe in words.
Thanks for your explanation. I think you described your position clearly.
> 2) I'm still not confident that Ivy is sincere in his desire to attack
> France. He has, since the beginning of the game, tried to lure me into a
> fight with France.
Remarkable. From my perspective, he has seemed genuinely interested in
attacking France, since the beginning of the game. Naturally he'd want an
ally in the matter, and Germany certainly hasn't been too helpful in that
regard.
> > I once again find myself writing to congratulate you on your
> > ability to blind-side me. And I again find myself asking, was
> > there anything I could have done differently to retain Italy
> > as an ally?
> >
>
> Allowing Russia to re-capture his home centers. I think that would have
> forced me to remain allied with you since Russia would be strong enough to
> assist you against me.
Amazing. That's actually what I was favoring; when the Thursday deadline
passed, my orders were Bla S Sev-Rum. But I got the impression you were
uncomfortable with me taking Bud, and that you wanted me to attack Russia.
You even suggested I hit Moscow. I'll have to re-read your press and see if
I misinterpreted you somehow. Ivy at one point questioned my pro-Russian
proposals, suggesting that they would be regarded with suspicion by Italy,
since it might imply that I was planning to attack you. Really fascinating.
Well, I expected to learn a lot from this game, and so far I have *not* been
disappointed.
> I have heard from all of the Western powers and each one is concerned
about
> my, as one person termed it, '300 lb gorilla' size. They too see the
threat
> of Italy's size. It would not surprise me to see France turn his
attention
> my way as opposed to continuing his revenge tactics towards England.
Well, I can only hope. ;^)
All I can say is, I look forward to the contest, though not to the expected
results. And if you change your mind, you know where to find me.
Ali
Message from Italy to Turkey
>
> So you're saying that if the deadline hadn't been extended,
> you really would have attacked France?
>
Only if I would have gained Bud and Vie. My timing might be off in regards
to what agreement was in place prior to the deadline being extended but I
think we were at the point of Italy getting Bud/Vie and moving to GOL/Pie
while Turkey remained in SEV with a gambit in Mos (which would have worked
by the way). It wasn't until England got involved that Spain was brought
into the equation.
>
> And here I was worried about you stabbing me when I had my
> armies out of position in Russia.
>
But my fleets would not have been in position. Plus, I was assuming that
one of your builds would have been a fleet thus effectively preventing my
stab. You can still build a fleet but of course I'm already in the Aegean
with support.
>
> > 2) I'm still not confident that Ivy is sincere in his
> desire to attack
> > France. He has, since the beginning of the game, tried to
> lure me into a
> > fight with France.
>
> Remarkable. From my perspective, he has seemed genuinely
> interested in attacking France, since the beginning of the
> game. Naturally he'd want an ally in the matter, and
> Germany certainly hasn't been too helpful in that regard.
>
You once mentioned something to me about being able to read a player and
having a reasonable idea what he would do. Just call it a gut feeling.
It's my Diplomacy intuition that Ivy's not on the level on this matter.
>
> Amazing. That's actually what I was favoring; when the
> Thursday deadline passed, my orders were Bla S Sev-Rum.
> But I got the impression you were uncomfortable with me
> taking Bud, and that you wanted me to attack Russia.
I was only uncomfortable, as it turns out, if you got Bud AND you remained
in Sev. The bad news for you is that I didn't come to that realization
until you were gone. By that time, there was nothing I could do to
negotiate. That's the bad part of email vs ftf Dip.
> You even suggested I hit Moscow. I'll have to re-read your
> press and see if I misinterpreted you somehow.
>
I recall you asking me if you thought you should try for Moscow IF you
stayed in Sev. I answered honestly by saying yes. This would have given me
Bud and Vie. I would have done that.
> Ivy at one point questioned my pro-Russian
> proposals, suggesting that they would be regarded with
> suspicion by Italy,
> since it might imply that I was planning to attack you.
>
Moral of the story: don't listen to Ivy so closely.
Roberto
Message from Germany to Turkey
Ali:
Sorry if I've seemed silent. It's on purpose. We really didn't have a
lot to discuss, until now. I like this game, but not to the tune of
spending 2 hours a night reading and writing email.
I will give a look at my overall strategy.
I don't know what to do with England and France. I've been going with
Ivy. What has that gotten us so far. We have 5 English units vs 5
French units. With a little help from me France should already be on
the way out. That is certainly not the case. The problem remains the
English Fleet in the North Sea. Turn after turn it's sitting there.
Why? Certainly there is an excuse for it now, but there really wasn't
when it went in. Ivy apprised my of his intentions to move there. I
was totally against it. For two reasons. 1) It threatened HOL and DEN.
2)We were disengaged on that front, once we are engaged it's very
difficult to withdraw. This prediction has come to pass. Ivy is
very resistant to withdrawing from the North Sea, because of the stab
possibility from my DEN fleet. (with good reason) So he wants to set
up a bounce to keep the North Sea free. In other words, another turn
wasted. Hell he could even get booted out of the Channel if France plays
it right.
This all is crap. I need an ally would will make some bold moves. At
this pace Italy will have won the game before England breaks in on
France.
So I'm a little pissed about England's play. Therefore, switching
alliances to France seems like an option. Unfortunately, France isn't
really in any kind of position to be of use. I'd like him to at least
spook Italy, but if we combine forces and attack England he'll need all
of his fleets in the north to be successful. That'll go over well later
on. We all know what happens when France takes out England with a lot
of fleets, he continues on into Germany.
I don't know what I'll do about E and F. Maybe they'll attack me, and
solve that problem :-(
My major worry right now is Italy. There's only one way that I see
that he can be stopped. That's if you and Russia combine forces.
That's why I offered to leave Russia alone if he turns STP over to me.
I also intend to use that build to build an army and move south with
it. In other words, we get rid of a Russian fleet which is worthless,
and replace it with a German army sitting on Italys northern border.
(It just takes a year to get there)
Russia and I are working on the details of that plan.
Fredd
Message from France to Turkey
Ali:
Thanks for the note and the warning. I have taken it to heart.
Although I may be force to deal with Italy and hope for the best. I
will be as cautious as I can. I will reveal as little of my plans as
possible. Hopefully we need not coordinate very much.
I was concerned about him taking Spain. I actually though England would
support him to Spain and hold in the MAO. I guess they did not know for
certain what Brest would do. I did not offer that information, which
was wise.
I truly hope you hold on. It is for selfish reasons, as it helps me,
and for personal reasons, because I enjoy talking with you.
--Prince Boar
Message from Italy to all
And adjustments haven't processed because ......
Italy: BUILD Fleet Naples
Italy: BUILD Army Venice
Turkey: BUILD Fleet Smyrna
Centers
England: 5
France: 5
Germany: 6
Italy: 8
Russia: 3
Turkey: 7
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