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Message from England to Russia
Eric -
Big showdown this weekend by our surrogates. Some notes about the Ravens/Raiders game this weekend, at Oakland. I take no responsibility for these numbers, which may have imagined or made up:
1. #1 most penalized team (Raiders) meets #2 most penalized team (Ravens)
2. League's worst rushing defense (Raiders) welcomes to town the league's leading rusher (Jamal Lewis, Ravens)
3. Raiders are a *six* *point* home *dog* - not good, but
4. they are according to their own coach "the dumbest team in America," a statement for which he has made 1,000 mea culpas, but he is done in Oakland
5. Like most of their home games, the Raiders have not been able to sell it out. Tickets are widely available and reportedly inexpensive
6. Besides the penalty issue, these two teams are probably among the most universally /disliked/ outside of their fan bases
___________________
My guess is, KIE is up for grabs this year. Thank you for supporting me in - as you can see, it turned out I needed the build - and I would appreciate such intelligence as you can send my way about the F/G negotiations, so I can plot my coordinates.
Is there anything you need/want from me?
Ben
Message from Austria to Russia
Eric,
Having helped the Juggernaut along, I realise the risk I'm currently in,
but I have no intention of going against you as a desperate move.
You have twice my land forces in the region and even if I were able to
take one sc from you, I would not survive your reprisal, not counting
the sharks who would smell blood.
This being said, I'm hoping that my cooperation is worth more then the
few sc you would get out of eliminating me. The counter-part to your
more open path of expansion then Jason is that you also have more
threat to worry about then he. Your position in the north is far from
secure and while Tony, like me, is in trouble, the only gains you have
made out of it at the moment is the retention of your holding in the north
with England is busy elsewhere; but who know how long this will last?
So, since your many units also have multiples places to deal with, I'm
sure you have some good suggestion for us both and I look forward to
hearing them.
Regards,
Philippe
Message from Russia to Italy
Andy,
Just a quick message for now -- I'm buried at work.
I don't truly expect you to believe that I screwed things up, but when you
read the press log, you'll see that I clearly just lost track of the fact
that Gal-Bud was an option. I imagine I've been flamed/taken to task quite a
bit by the observers, because that's a huge oversight, and I failed to
realize it until a while after the moves processed. One of those things where
my mind's picture of the map got out of date (despite the good things you
hear about me, I am a relative newbie that doesn't play frequently -- this is
probably my 8th game or so over a 5 year "career") and I just failed to
visualize the map correctly and see the real options. Had I gotten that
straight, I probably would have made the moves you suggested, because I agree
it was clearly better than whan I did (though not necessarily better than
getting a build from Vie).
I'll write you back to discuss strategy separately, but I wanted to address
that one.
--- Eric
Message from Germany to all
Turkey, I blame you for my downfall. So my wil and testament requests that
England, France and Italy position their fleets as such to allow me to
convoy
to CON to have a few words to you. I will be bording in HEL and hopping vai
NTH, ENG, MAO, WES, TYS, ION, AEG to CON.
I would be gratefull if the AEG would assist in this operation.You owe me at
least that much for all the bad advice you have been pressing me these last
few years.
Message from Austria to all
Hi all,
I'm not going to be available this week-end and will
get back to everyone monday.
Philippe
Message from Italy to Russia
>
> I'll write you back to discuss strategy separately, but I wanted to address
> that one.
>
Well....why would you think I would feel that way?
But we definitely need to talk strategy, so I look forward to hearing from
you
take care
Andy
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
I have broached the subject of Holland with France but he is silent. I suspect he is being silent with everyone, though. Have you heard anything?
Ben
Message from Russia to all
This has been a hellishly busy week for me and the weekend doesn't look
much better. (Then again, neither does next week, so I'll just try to deal
with it and not request any extensions). While I've managed to dash off a
note here and there, I've mostly disappeared for the last two days. My
apologies to those who are owed notes from me, I will attempt to get notes
out before the end of the night.
In addition to overall time management issues, my ISP started deciding
sometime last week that certain messages from USTX are spam. This means
that I didn't see some messages for days after they arrived here, and
because of user error a couple of those messages were immediately deleted.
I *believe* that I have at least seen every message that was sent to me,
even if I still don't have a copy on hand, but if you sent anything really
important to me in the last few days, I request that you resend it.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Turkey
Thinking about the board finally, it looks like we could start pressing
against A and I simultaneously if you'd like. You seemed to think that
Austria had given Italy info about your moves for last Fall -- you're
probably right -- he's likely trying to play you against Italy. That's
probably the only way he's going to survive.
If you are interested in doing this (taking on both of them), then I think
we should put off the Rum unit swap, and just go straight out for centers.
What I'd suggest is something like: you support me into Bud, while either
taking Gre, or supporting yourself to Eas (I'd suggest the latter to keep
Andy from slipping into Eas or Aeg). With that we'll both end up at least
plus one this year. Depending on the situation after those moves, we can
hold as is, I can press for Vie, we could try to get you Tri, I could give
you Rum, and/or you can try to take the Ion. Next year we'd push to get you
Tri and me Vie (whichever were left over from before) and we can trade Rum
around if either of us really needs an extra build (a fleet in Rum
shouldn't be a problem for either of us).
What do you think?
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Italy
Andy,
Yours was one of those messages that was marked as spam and inadvertently
deleted. I believe in that message you asked "why would I (Andy) think that
about you (Eric)?" Since I don't have the message anymore, I don't know
what the word "that" referred to in your message. If you were looking for a
response, please follow up with a specific question.
Well, my thinking for IR cooperation was to be in Vie this Spring and then
look at swinging around towards Jason as we discussed (with much the same
center distribution), just a season late. That won't work as easily now,
but is still possible.
I was not kidding in my broadcast about not having any time recently, so I
haven't looked over the board much at all (I wish I had your FtF experience
to help here). Because of this I don't have a lot of specific ideas.
Obviously, we could get you into Tri. If we went this route I don't know
whether I would help you take Tri in Spring or Fall; depending on what
moves are talked about in Spring it might make sense to not anger Philippe
prior to Fall. Other things that we could do together: I could try to
convince Jason that he should support Smy-Eas in Spring to keep you from
slipping into Aeg or Eas. This would allow you to get into position to
potentially hold Gre while taking Tri. The option of moving to Arm is also
open still. Assuming we did all of this, I'd want to get you into Ser (if
I'd had a chance I would have asked you to retreat Ser to Alb, though I can
see why you might not like that) though that might take a while, since I'd
have to push through to Bud or get an army in Rum to help you there. I'd
like your take on whether this is even a sensible way to move forward or if
you have any better ideas.
Given my history to date, you are probably skeptical about whether I mean
any of the above. On the assumption that you think I'm blowing smoke up
your you know what, I'll give you a couple of reasons I think you should
believe me. If you look back at my responses to you last season, I never
actually said I would tap Bud or Rum, nor move to Arm. I know that's
largely a lame statement because agreement was implied, but I was very
careful to not actually promise you something I was afraid I might not
deliver. I also know that long term someone will need to have fleets in the
Med to hold whomever comes out of the west in check, and there is no way in
hell that's going to be me; it could be Jason, but there are obvious
reasons why it would make more sense for me to have it be you there.
Finally, turn after turn I've gotten really strong offers from each of
Jason and Philippe (that they keep delivering on) that benefit me if I let
them cooperate against you, so it made sense to me to work with them
despite our discussions. This season it doesn't look like they are going to
be able to cooperate against you (at least not in a way that aids me) so
it's a different environment.
Anyway, I'd better send this, because I sat down to write it and my
broadcast 6 hours ago, and just now am finding time to finish it. If I've
failed to address anything -- and I probably have -- please call me on it.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Austria
Philippe,
Well, you won't get this for a while, but I need to send it anyway.
The most obvious way I can see for us to work together is to get an
army into Rum, and press Turkey in the middle Balkans. That army
could be either Austrian or Russian. The advantage of an Austrian
army there is that it gets you an SC early, and it puts you in
control of both units facing Turkey; the downside is that it leaves
one of my units behind you in Gal. The advantage of a Russian army in
Rum is that it gets my army out of Gal; the disadvantage is that it
means that you cannot be guaranteed a build, because getting Ser or
Bul may take an extra season or two.
Either combination has the effect of giving Andy some room to
breathe, because if either of us threatens Turkey and it causes him
to get defensive, he might end up allowing Andy to slip into the EMed
or Aeg and then Andy could start seeing some growth from it. That
could be a downside to you, I'm not sure.
In terms of specific moves, I am imagining Bud/Gal-Rum with the other
supporting, I'd likely use Boh in the north in Spring (meaning you'd
need Vie S Tri). Then in Fall, depending on who's moved where, Boh
can support you in Tri if necessary, allowing Bud to try to take Ser,
or we can try some sort of attack focused towards Andy (maybe
Vie/Boh-Tyl).
These are all just initial thoughts. My broadcast is accurate in that
I have had very little time to think about the game. In fact, the
above move suggestions all come without benefit of looking at the
board, and I'm not as good as a lot of other folks in getting the
details of the map correct from memory. So please look over my
suggestions and tell me what you think about them, and whether you'd
like to go with these moves or something else.
I'll look for your response on Monday. Please be as detailed as you
can in your response about first, second and third choices of moves,
etc. because it's going to be a very busy day and I may be limited in
the number of times I can write. (In other words, I'll be as
available as I normally am).
Thanks, good luck, and I hope you had a good weekend.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
To quote a famous analyst:
"Lemme 'splain. No 'splaining takes too much time, lemme sum up: The
Ravens are good. The Raiders suck. The Ravens will win."
[Hey, that reminds me of the short-lived Tzarface thing, which also
reminds me: did I ever tell you that for Halloween my wife dressed up
as a fairy godmother, and so I ended up dressing up as the fairy
Godfather, complete with horse head-topped wand? I know I kept
thinking about mentioning it, since you were the only one who seemed
to like the Tzarface persona, but I don't know if I ever did.]
Anyway, on the R&R front: I don't why you have to do all of the
analysis when it's basically as simple. I recall in the game last
week against the Steelers when the analysts were saying "It's the
movable object (Oakland's 32nd ranked rushing defense) meeting the
resistible force (Pittsburgh's 31st ranked rushing offense)." This
could be really ugly. Watch out record books!
The sad thing is that as you note I will be listening to the game on
my old-fashioned AM radio, because it won't be televised. And the
radio reception sucks, because Santa Cruz is on the far side of a
mountain range that effectively blocks most broadcast media coming
from San Francisco/San Jose. I probably won't be able to see them
play again until they meet the Chargers for the season ender -- the
battle for the number one draft pick. Sigh, I don't even seem to get
to watch the Broncos go down in flames (the next best thing to a
Super Bowl win for most Raiders fans).
------------------------------------
Onto diplomacy:
Obviously I've been pretty silent. I haven't from Tony or Erik,
except for brief checkins that in Erik's case got listed as spam so
was unreplied to. With Tony, right after the moves he and I talked
about some general stuff that was not at all specific to this game
(he's kind of easy to talk to if you're not actually trying to
negotiate with him), so I have no idea what either is planning.
Tony's disbands indicate to me that he is looking to help one of us
Eri(c|k)s over you. Given the combined silence, I'd assume he's
helping France.
I don't see any reason why I can't try to help you keep Kie. I agree
that it may fall, but gaining Kie means losing Ber if I tap it, and
from Ber I can help you get Kie back, possibly even before you lose
the SC. I'm thinking something like Den S Kie, Nth-Hel, Lon-Nth,
while I tap Ber. Or you could do something like Den-Hel, Nth S
Lon-Eng, Lvp-Iri, and really start pressing Erik. The former is more
aggressive in terms of trying to hold Kie, but if you DO lose Kie the
latter moves allow you to retreat to Den, while keeping pressure all
up and down the north coast of Europe. In fact, with the latter you
could possibly retake Kie and pick up one of Hol/Bel/Bre, which would
place Erik in a very difficult guessing game for defense.
I've really not spent much time at all analyzing the board, so I may
well be overlooking some important details. But I thought it
important to put something specific on the table to start from given
my lack of availability.
Let me know what you'd like to do, and I'll try to respond quickly.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Germany
Tony,
<Insert lame "I'm too busy to write" excuse here. I'm sick of writing them.:)>
What's your thinking these days. You mention that you think I'll have
the best offers for you -- what are you thinking those would be? What
are you looking to get out of the endgame? As I see it, you are
poised to help either Erik or me -- or ask for help from one of us --
but I'm not sure what your plan is. Even your EFR message leaves me a
little confused, because I can't tell whether you would rather see me
do well (to try to prove your point correct) see France do well, or
just see England hurt because he didn't take Nwy.
Let me know what you are looking to get out of the rest of the game.
If we can come up with some way to work together that keeps the game
interesting for you, I'd be happy to do so. I was not kidding when I
said I have been impressed by your play, and I wouldn't mind getting
some ideas from you for how to go forward.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to France
Erik,
Yours was one of the messages that was identified as spam. Sorry I
didn't respond earlier, I thought you were the one being silent!
Well, part of it is that I had to change my southern moves at the
last minute. I referred to a screwup on my part, you'll be able to
read about it in the press logs later, and it really affected things
for me. When I looked at what was happening in the south, I realized
I was not going to have the unit strength to push against Ben, so was
worried about pissing him off. I also didn't like the idea of putting
my faith in Tony, even though I was ready to go through with it since
I knew I could count on you.
But the kicker was that right at the end of the turn, when I finally
sat down with my trust Realpolitik, I looked at what we had planned
and realized that Tony getting Den made an EG alliance almost certain
(because Ben wouldn't be able to attack anyone without Tony's help,
and you and I would have just attacked him), and it *didn't* hurt
Ben's defense against you at all. The agreed to moves with Tony
(Kie-Den, Bal S Kie-Den) would have caused Den to be disbanded, and
Ben would get a rebuild; if Ben held Den, he'd have get a center and
a build. Neither would be any different from his defense's point of
view. I never expected that Ben would actually get a second build --
remember, I wrote you right near the end that I expected Tony to
order Mun S Ber-Kie? That would have held Ben at one build (the same
as him losing but disbanding Den).
So thinking that it would be a move that didn't really affect you,
kept an EG from forming (good for both of us) and might keep me on
Ben's good side (okay, that one is a little selfish, but if it helped
me get intel it could help you), I decided to change the orders and
explain it away after the moves. Then Tony went and didn't follow the
plan that I thought was best for him, and blew the entire idea. I had
no idea how to respond, so sent that lame "sorry" message before I
got buried at work and stopped writing messages almost altogether.
The good news is that Tony is basically gone and we should be able to
establish an easy to maintain unit arrangement around Mun quickly.
Ben is really strung out of position (you actually mentioned that you
liked the idea of him in Kie a season or so ago) with no way of
attacking the mainland unless one of us helps him. If you want to
cooperate there's lots of opportunities, and then we can each go our
own ways (you further on towards England, me to the south).
Let me know what you think. And also know that I've reset my spam
filter's training and will try to be more aggressive about checking
the spam mailbox for messages that get sent there.
--- Eric
Message from France to Russia
Eric:
The main difference is that instead of dealing with two crippled players,
we're dealing with one almost decimated player and one significantly
stronger player. Frankly, there was little chance of an EG, even if you
did support Germany into Den. The trust wasn't there.
In any case, I am certainly not going after Ben now, not with a lone fleet
in Iri, unless you have a very specific plan for doing so. This is
unfortunate for you, as there are English units directly bordering several
centers that you control, and not much in the way of other targets for
them to go after. I would suggest you start looking for a way to deal with
them; if you come up with a plan, let me know.
Now, what are we going to do with Mun? I've got an angry Italian to think
about now, but if you're willing to support me into Munich, I might be
able to fight a two-front war and build a fleet in Bre to help you out.
Erik
Message from Germany to Russia
Hi Eric, well to be honest there is not much I can do except maybe play the
puppet roll.
I really messed up in the begin stages when I made craapy moves against
France.
I over analysed the moves available and also thought that EF would have
worked together.
I never had to lose MUN and even the most basic moves would have been better
than the moves I carried out around the RUH/MUN area. It's just been one of
those games ;-)
I wonder what would have happened had I carried through on the western
tripple from day one. Alas, a little to late now.
Well the analysis I gave is how I see the game going, you and Turkey taking
Italy/AUstria and Germany.
EF had their last chance when England should have built in EDI. The French
build does indicate that he for one had faith in the options open to them.
This will be your last critical year, if England once again fails to head
north and take NWY then you will be home and dry for the coming years.
I still believe his best option would have been to attack you last year. He
would have still received his two builds and would have had expansion
possibilities to the north. That would have messed you up really bad. It
will be interesting to find out how/why he made the decision he did.
All I have to offer is the following.
BER - KIE supported by BAL
SWE - DEN cutting support
RUH - HOL cutting support
SIL - BER
This does ensure that Kiel falls and I stay on as a Russsian puppet. I swap
BER for KIE.
Although I asked for England to support BER and for France to support me
inot MUN I dont see them doing so.
Ben was obviously to worried about the thought of being stuck between you
and France hence the build in LVP.
If I am to exit then I would obviously prefer someone to solo than say a
three or four way draw.
Englands two builds havent really helped in. I said that you would like
nothing better for EF to slog it out whilst RT inch their way forward. I
dont believe Ben is seeing the big picture so he deserves to be punished :-)
Although you and I know he should move NTH - NWG, LON - NTH and defend BER I
dont think he will. He doesnt realise this will be he last chance. Any gain
you make will be put in STP. Its your weak back door.
Maybe the "told you so" will be enough for me before I exit. So that what I
can offer. BER for KIE. If England does decide to move north then you stilll
at least have me in KIE and on your side.
You can ofcourse just take BER yourself, as I said I dont believe Ben will
support BER. and I cant stop it being taken without him. I did make a
mistake. I was sure that I disbanded RUH and not MUN. I messed up there. AI
did ask for a last minute support. I move MUN - BOH supported by TRY and cut
support from SIL. As I messed uo with my disbands I cant do so now. There
was no hidden strategic tactical disband, it was a genuine mistake.
Luckily my other 18 games are going a lot better.
Tony
Message from Germany to Russia
I have set wait. For now I had ordered BER hold and RUH - MUN.
BER I hoped would be supported by DEN and BUR is hopefully supporting RUH -
MUN.
I doubt it. So let me know if I need to change my orders. SWE - DEN seems
the move to make in either casee. If england does support me then you have
to cut it. If I move to KIE then SWE needs to cut DEN anyway.
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> "Lemme 'splain. No 'splaining takes too much time, lemme sum up: The
> Ravens are good. The Raiders suck. The Ravens will win."
The game will be, let me see, alittle less than half 'a 'our.
> [Hey, that reminds me of the short-lived Tzarface thing, which also
> reminds me: did I ever tell you that for Halloween my wife dressed up
> as a fairy godmother, and so I ended up dressing up as the fairy
> Godfather, complete with horse head-topped wand? I know I kept
> thinking about mentioning it, since you were the only one who seemed
> to like the Tzarface persona, but I don't know if I ever did.]
:-) One day when I'm good maybe I'll get the hand of role-playing.
> Anyway, on the R&R front: I don't why you have to do all of the
> analysis when it's basically as simple. I recall in the game last
> week against the Steelers when the analysts were saying "It's the
> movable object (Oakland's 32nd ranked rushing defense) meeting the
> resistible force (Pittsburgh's 31st ranked rushing offense)." This
> could be really ugly. Watch out record books!
You are right, though I think last week was a bit of a fluke. I would expect the Raiders to show alittle more life this week then last.
------------------------------------
> Obviously I've been pretty silent. I haven't from Tony or Erik,
> except for brief checkins that in Erik's case got listed as spam so
> was unreplied to. With Tony, right after the moves he and I talked
> about some general stuff that was not at all specific to this game
> (he's kind of easy to talk to if you're not actually trying to
> negotiate with him), so I have no idea what either is planning.
> Tony's disbands indicate to me that he is looking to help one of us
> Eri(c|k)s over you. Given the combined silence, I'd assume he's
> helping France.
You are probably right.
> I don't see any reason why I can't try to help you keep Kie. I agree
> that it may fall, but gaining Kie means losing Ber if I tap it, and
> from Ber I can help you get Kie back, possibly even before you lose
> the SC. I'm thinking something like Den S Kie, Nth-Hel, Lon-Nth,
> while I tap Ber. Or you could do something like Den-Hel, Nth S
> Lon-Eng, Lvp-Iri, and really start pressing Erik. The former is more
> aggressive in terms of trying to hold Kie, but if you DO lose Kie the
> latter moves allow you to retreat to Den, while keeping pressure all
> up and down the north coast of Europe. In fact, with the latter you
> could possibly retake Kie and pick up one of Hol/Bel/Bre, which would
> place Erik in a very difficult guessing game for defense.
>
> I've really not spent much time at all analyzing the board, so I may
> well be overlooking some important details. But I thought it
> important to put something specific on the table to start from given
> my lack of availability.
:-) No sweat, about that.
> Let me know what you'd like to do, and I'll try to respond quickly.
For now, support KIE if you care to; it's not going anywhere. I'll write if that changes.
Ben
Message from Turkey to Russia
An interesting plan. It would certainly divide Austria up fairly.
How are things coming in the north with England and Germany? You
obviously have several avenues of advance there to bolster your cause.
Because of that, it might make more sense for you to focus on the north,
while I focus more on the south.
jason
Message from Russia to France
Erik,
>Frankly, there was little chance of an EG, even if you
>did support Germany into Den. The trust wasn't there.
I disagree, because they didn't need to trust each other to team up. All
they had to do was not attack each other and Germany could have hurt you
while England hurt me.
>In any case, I am certainly not going after Ben now, not with a lone fleet
>in Iri, unless you have a very specific plan for doing so.
Well, I was clearly dumb not to have made time to talk with you before the
builds. After all, you have a lone fleet because that's how you chose to
build. I should have talked to you about F Bre. I think that was a very
strong option for you, but it's as much my fault that you didn't take it
given that I didn't say anything to you. Bad timing on my lack of availability.
>This is
>unfortunate for you, as there are English units directly bordering several
>centers that you control, and not much in the way of other targets for
>them to go after. I would suggest you start looking for a way to deal with
>them; if you come up with a plan, let me know.
Trust me, I am WELL aware of this problem. It is something of a theme here
in Moscow. But compare: now there is F Nth and F Den. In Fall there was F
Nth, F Den and F Ska, and as we saw, ordering the support we discussed
would *not* have changed that. So while I've got a crappy position, it's
much less of a crappy position than I would have had if I went along with
trying to support Tony, and your position is not *much* worse than it would
have been with our agreed to moves. I think you can admit those points,
even if you still think it was a bad overall play.
>Now, what are we going to do with Mun? I've got an angry Italian to think
>about now,
I think you are missing some whole-board thinking here. Who is the player
that has the most say in whether or not Italy builds any more units?
Contrary to my own self interests, I've been letting both Austria and
Turkey operate against Italy, and as a result he has no units to throw your
way. I completely buy that you are upset that I've kept Ben around (though
that is as much a problem for me as for you), but don't overlook the fact
that the ONLY reason there is not a 7-8 center Italy to your south is that
is because I haven't been allowing him to get builds. I even pointed this
out to you in a message several few seasons ago, and made it clear that
this was not accidental.
>but if you're willing to support me into Munich, I might be
>able to fight a two-front war and build a fleet in Bre to help you out.
My point above is that we have lots of reason to cooperate that go beyond
"get me one center or else" (which is how I read your message). I am very
much in favor of us working together, but what are you going to do with A
Mun once you get it? I'm a little wary of the idea of getting you into Mun
and then playing by ear the "will you help me" part. How do you see us
working together with you in Mun? It seems to me that with all of our units
in the area, if we moved boldly we could potentially take Kie, Ber, Den and
Mun between us. Two builds each, Ben down two unit. Actually, only one
build for me and Ben down only one if he does attack me, but still a very
doable plan.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Turkey
>How are things coming in the north with England and Germany? You
>obviously have several avenues of advance there to bolster your cause.
>Because of that, it might make more sense for you to focus on the north,
>while I focus more on the south.
Too be honest, I don't know. I haven't been diploming enough with anyone
recently, but that is why I had all of those different ideas about going
forward in my last message. If I have expansion in the north -- or even
just hold even -- then I really only need one or two centers from the
south, while you can take the rest and run over Italy. If France really is
going to come after him too (as it looks like) then you need to get to Tun
soon, since that's key to both getting into France, but also keeping France
from soloing if things go badly for me in the North, which is not very
unlikely at this point.
Does this mean that you like the idea of hitting A now, or that you have a
different plan? Inherent in my suggestions is that you get all of Italy --
I have no need of those centers in an RT, so even if we "split" the Balkans
evenly, you'd still be getting LOTS of centers. And again, if I do really
well in the north, then I can shift north and give you Rum early to help
even things out.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Germany
Tony,
>I really messed up in the begin stages when I made craapy moves against
>France.
Well, my honest opinion of my own moves is not very far off. I've made
crappy moves probably every other turn. I've just been a lot luckier than
you in that (so far at least) I haven't been under the kind of pressure you
have.
>I wonder what would have happened had I carried through on the western
>tripple from day one. Alas, a little to late now.
Selfishly, I'm glad that you didn't. :)
>That [Ben going north] would have messed you up really bad. It
>will be interesting to find out how/why he made the decision he did.
I would be hurt very badly by his coming north. I would not have been
surprised to see him do it
>All I have to offer is the following.
>BER - KIE supported by BAL
>SWE - DEN cutting support
>RUH - HOL cutting support
>SIL - BER
That is basically the move set I would have offered had I come to you
first. However you go, I'd like to see you take Kie. If Kie is gone -- even
just to Hel -- I'm in much better shape than I would be otherwise. Your
second message said you are doing something else. Are you up for the moves
you listed here?
>This does ensure that Kiel falls and I stay on as a Russsian puppet. I swap
>BER for KIE.
And if you maintain the unit in Ruh, we could try to get you another center
with it come fall; probably Mun (with the idea that it would move to Hol
the next year), but it depends on the actual situation -- I could even see
trying to get you into Den. You can see that at this point, I have no
reason to try to eliminate you, since you hold very important positions
that I'd like to have influence over. Fighting to get there myself is much
harder than getting help to get there.
>Although I asked for England to support BER and for France to support me
>into MUN I dont see them doing so.
Well, given that France is demanding that I support him to Mun, I tend to
agree this is unlikely. :)
>Englands two builds havent really helped in. I said that you would like
>nothing better for EF to slog it out whilst RT inch their way forward. I
>dont believe Ben is seeing the big picture so he deserves to be punished :-)
Well, I give him a little more credit than that, but it does indicate he's
pretty worried about France. It remains to see whether they fight or not.
>You can of course just take BER yourself, as I said I dont believe Ben will
>support BER. and I cant stop it being taken without him.
Yeah, forcing you to retreat towards War is a really good option for me! :)
>I did make a
>mistake. I was sure that I disbanded RUH and not MUN. I messed up there. AI
>did ask for a last minute support. I move MUN - BOH supported by TRY and cut
>support from SIL. As I messed uo with my disbands I cant do so now. There
>was no hidden strategic tactical disband, it was a genuine mistake.
How frustrating. I had just assumed that you were looking to order Ruh S
Bur-Mun.
>Luckily my other 18 games are going a lot better.
Did I say I think you are insane? :) I can't even keep up with one or two
games. But I'm glad to hear the others are gong well.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
> > Let me know what you'd like to do, and I'll try to respond quickly.
>For now, support KIE if you care to; it's not going anywhere. I'll write
>if that changes.
Well, I did now hear from France. I'm getting mixed signals from him. On
the one hand, he's quite angry that I supported you into Kie. On the other
hand, he's still feeling out whether or not I'm willing to help him get
into Mun and Kie to press his attack on you and get him builds use against
you. But nothing specific enough for useful intel at this point.
What are you hearing from him at this point?
What else do you need from me to see things work for you?
--- Eric
Message from Germany to Russia
>Your second message said you are doing something else. Are you up for the
moves
you listed here?> Yes I am in for them even it is just to say to Ben, "told
you so".
>You can see that at this point, I have no reason to try to eliminate you,
since you hold very important positions
that I'd like to have influence over. Fighting to get there myself is much
harder than getting help to get there.>
You can count me in, they are about the only moves that could give pleasure.
> Well, given that France is demanding that I support him to Mun, I tend to
agree this is unlikely. :) >
:)
So all in all I am in for BER - KIE supported by BAL whilst SWE cuts
Denamark and I cut HOL support.
In fact just for the hell of it I have ordered just such moves.
Message from France to Russia
Okay, perhaps I was a little hasty in my disappointment with you. I
certainly do appreciate how well Italy has been tied up all game, and we
have both done quite well working together so far. I just really didn't
want F Iri to be left out in the cold.
Given your decision to change orders without telling me, I figured I was
being left to fend off England on my own, and since that was a tall order,
I thought it best to make peace and focus on Italy instead. Hence, F Mar.
I apologize for not making greater efforts to speak with you prior to the
builds. In any case, Austria is quite heartened by my appearance in the
south, and I think I may have thrown some fuel on the AIR fire that will
keep it going for a while.
As of right now, Ben is being a bit more terse with me than he used to,
but, I think, has been willing to put differences aside in order to work
against you. I would expect Nth - Ska, Lon - Nth and Lvp - Cly, but that's
just a guess. He may keep Lvp in place until I'm gone. He could also order
Nth - Nwg, Lon - Nth and give himself a supported attack on Norway in the
fall. So, you may need to be in a position to support F Nwy soon, and that
means forgoing much else in Ber / Mun / etc.
I can order Hol - Kiel to allow you to take Den, but could you hold through
the fall? Iri could also stay in place to keep Lvp occupied, but to
continue that fight, I'd need a build to ensure F Bre next adjustment
period -- this is where support into Munich would help.
Erik
Message from Turkey to Russia
That's fine, my main concern was that with the implosion of Germany, you
stand to gain a decent amount in the north, depending on how England reacts.
I'll go ahead and support you into Bud this season, and we'll see where
we end up.
jason
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> > > Let me know what you'd like to do, and I'll try to respond quickly.
>
> >For now, support KIE if you care to; it's not going anywhere. I'll write
> >if that changes.
Ok, did you decide? Will you go for MUN and support me in KIE?
> Well, I did now hear from France. I'm getting mixed signals from him. On
> the one hand, he's quite angry that I supported you into Kie. On the other
> hand, he's still feeling out whether or not I'm willing to help him get
> into Mun and Kie to press his attack on you and get him builds use against
> you. But nothing specific enough for useful intel at this point.
Hm. I imagine he will be pushing for RUH in the spring. Clearly Tony is
the wild card. What's he told you? As I recall he sent the group press
with a promise & did not vary from it in his private press to me. Is he
offering KIE?
> What are you hearing from him at this point?
IRI was to satisfy you (or Tony - not 100% clear) but it was clearly not an
invasion and will be withdrawn post haste. What else would he say?
> What else do you need from me to see things work for you?
Hard to say right now - the moves I'm framing out obviously don't need
coordination with you. Just the support in KIE, as I've said.
Nice game - damned if we didn't roll over. Glad I was in the car driving
through wind and rain and snow, so I only had to listen on the radio. . .
Ben
Message from Austria to Russia
Hi Eric,
Like you mentionned, while I'm worried about the implications of
the Juggernaut for me, I'm also worried about the implication of a
war between you and Jason in regards of Andy; but it seem that
Jason provided us with a solution.
I had requested Serbia from him and was waiting to see what he
would say about it, and he simply requested my support into Rum
in exchange. I accepted and provided it isn't a setup, we should be
able to manage the situation in the south so it's safe for both of us.
Knowing about my support against Rum in advance will allow you
to concentrate on the north while staying safe in the south; and my
position will be safe enough as Jason's expansion will be limited to
what he can get out of Andy.
So, it seem that Bud is going to Ser this spring and we just need to
figure out the rest. What is your take on it?
Philippe
Message from Russia to Austria
Philippe,
> I had requested Serbia from him and was waiting to see what he
> would say about it, and he simply requested my support into Rum
> in exchange. I accepted and provided it isn't a setup, we should be
> able to manage the situation in the south so it's safe for both of us.
> Knowing about my support against Rum in advance will allow you
> to concentrate on the north while staying safe in the south; and my
> position will be safe enough as Jason's expansion will be limited to
> what he can get out of Andy.
> So, it seem that Bud is going to Ser this spring and we just need to
> figure out the rest. What is your take on it?
I'm confused. Bud is the only unit that can support Jason to Rum, so it can't
be moving in Spring. What am I missing here? Can you give me more details on
what you are expecting the moves to be (both assuming I defend against them
and that I don't). Is it that he won't take Rum until Fall, and that you'll
support him from Ser?
Please let me know so I understand what I'm countering. I'm also gathering
from the "focus north" comments that you are using Vie to support Tri and so
don't need Boh to help you -- at least not in Spring. Is this all correct?
--- Eric
Message from Austria to Russia
I can't be sure what Jason had in mind, but I told him I would
support him into Rum from Ser this fall. As for Boh, you had
told me you wanted to use it in the spring and as long as it's
near Tyr in the fall, be it in Mun, that's ok with me.
Hope this is clearer,
Philippe
Message from Russia to France
> Okay, perhaps I was a little hasty in my disappointment with you. I
> certainly do appreciate how well Italy has been tied up all game, and we
> have both done quite well working together so far. I just really didn't
> want F Iri to be left out in the cold.
Again, I'll take the blame for this because of my crappy diplomacy after the
moves. I completely understand your anger given the circumstances, so I
wasn't complaining or even upset at your reaction.
> As of right now, Ben is being a bit more terse with me than he used to,
> but, I think, has been willing to put differences aside in order to work
> against you. I would expect Nth - Ska, Lon - Nth and Lvp - Cly, but that's
> just a guess. He may keep Lvp in place until I'm gone. He could also order
> Nth - Nwg, Lon - Nth and give himself a supported attack on Norway in the
> fall. So, you may need to be in a position to support F Nwy soon, and that
> means forgoing much else in Ber / Mun / etc.
That is the unfortunate situation as I see it as well. I appreciate the
intel. I'm planning to order Swe-Nwy to make sure he doesn't get anything in
Spring, and then we'll see how things are set up for the Fall.
> I can order Hol - Kiel to allow you to take Den, but could you hold through
> the fall?
I can't see that me taking Den improves my position at all. I'd lose just as
many units as with a more basic defense, especially if he snuck into Nwy
while I was taking it. It's not worth the effort in my mind.
> Iri could also stay in place to keep Lvp occupied, but to
> continue that fight, I'd need a build to ensure F Bre next adjustment
> period -- this is where support into Munich would help.
This is what I'd like to see. Is it okay if I support you into Mun in Fall?
There's actually a good chance you won't need it at all, but I will make sure
you get it if it is necessary. If you end up in Mun in Spring, I'll want
support to Ber in Fall.
Does that work for you?
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Austria
> I can't be sure what Jason had in mind, but I told him I would
> support him into Rum from Ser this fall. As for Boh, you had
> told me you wanted to use it in the spring and as long as it's
> near Tyr in the fall, be it in Mun, that's ok with me.
Gotcha.
And one more pointed question: If you are in Ser, would you be interested in
making a grab for Bul in Fall if the circumstances were right? I could
support you to Tyl after you got an army, and that would allow you to keep
Andy in check -- yes?
I'm not trying to be pushy about Jason, I'm just exploring options. There's
not a lot I can do against Andy at the moment, so just want to see what I
should have my units do. If that's just "sit tight and support Rum", I can do
that. And while I understand that you are worried about Andy, I've never
played with anyone who has used the tactics you are, so I'm just trying to
understand your motivation well enough to offer things that forward your
interests.
--- Eric
Message from Austria to Russia
> And one more pointed question: If you are in Ser, would you be interested in
> making a grab for Bul in Fall if the circumstances were right? I could
> support you to Tyl after you got an army, and that would allow you to keep
> Andy in check -- yes?
>
> I'm not trying to be pushy about Jason, I'm just exploring options. There's
> not a lot I can do against Andy at the moment, so just want to see what I
> should have my units do. If that's just "sit tight and support Rum", I can do
> that. And while I understand that you are worried about Andy, I've never
> played with anyone who has used the tactics you are, so I'm just trying to
> understand your motivation well enough to offer things that forward your
> interests.
I don't know about going for Bul. It's risky for me not to
provide the support requested by Jason and an army in
Bul isn't able to assist in my defence like one in Ser can,
so a move on Bull will probably have to wait for the
coming years.
Not sure how I'm doing, but I'm trying to survive and
adapt as best as I can to my neighbours. It's the first time
I worked hard to make an RT happen as Austria and
seeing me keep trying to balance things out when face by
one is probably just as weird for you, but I assure you I'm
not crazy ;-) If you wish to further my interest, I would
appreciate your being near enough to assist and far enough
to make it safe for me (not saying that you would betray me,
but if you aren't in position to do so, you won't have to figure
out the best way to reject request that goes against your
interest). Not sure how you should do this,but leaving Gal
alone is probably a good way to do so.
Regards,
Philippe
Message from Russia to England
> >For now, support KIE if you care to; it's not going anywhere. I'll write
> >if that changes.
>Ok, did you decide? Will you go for MUN and support me in KIE?
I am so glad to hear this question. I thought from your first message you
were not interested in a commitment, and it was an ominous feeling.
I've offered support for Kie from the get go. That's not changing. I wasn't
clear that you had a vested interest in me taking Mun. I've certainly
considered it -- can you tell me why it's important so I can add that to my
planning.
> Clearly Tony is the wild card. What's he told you?
Does it matter? :) He's told me that he'll cut Kie to allow me to attack Den,
if I'll leave him one of Ber or Kie in exchange. I actually believe him on
this, since Ber-Kie is kind of a must for him regardless. He'll probably also
try (again) to get you to take Nwy while he thinks he's pinned Swe in place.
> IRI was to satisfy you (or Tony - not 100% clear) but it was clearly not >
an invasion and will be withdrawn post haste. What else would he say?
Yeah, good back pedal. :)
> Hard to say right now - the moves I'm framing out obviously don't need
> coordination with you. Just the support in KIE, as I've said.
Okay. I'll also be moving Swe-Nwy, which puts us in the position we had
discussed (Nwy empty or patrolled by an army), and should give you a more
comfortable feeling about the "FR pincer" than Tony went on and on about. I
think it actually gets me a better defensive position, too.
I should probably end the Diplomacy part of message here, but I just want to
address one last set of jitters I'm getting this season:
More than one player has told me that you are coming after m. Now, one of
those players has said that every season for the last three, but hearing this
from others is a whole new thing, and it sounds potentially credible as I
hear it from them. Now generally I don't put a lot of weight into such things
because stirring up the pot is part of the game, but it is making me
concerned.
When I look at that and review your messages with a more paranoid eye, I note
that you have not said anything since the builds that would preclude your
discussion being about moving east instead of south, just that our moves
don't need much coordination. I know you tell me not to worry about such
things, but this all combines to make me wonder whether or not you're
suddently getting coy with me. I have to admit that I am more nervous about
your plans this turn than I have been at any point in the past.
So one more time I'm going to paint the ugly pictures to try to calm my own
nerves:
Me attacking you: All I could try to do is take Den, but that puts me in bad
position if you were not coming after me because Den-Ska means I lose Nwy and
have to protect StP next year, and I'd never see gains in Germany proper
(you'd see to that). And if I attacked you whle you did move against me, it's
an even worse move. Taking Kie as you suggest is no better, as I'd be
completely out of position to defend myself from your reprisal.
You attacking me: You could actually take several of my centers, but not
without losing at least one to France for every one you gained (I'd see to
that -- I know Erik is still interested in occupying the isle and out
growning you). In the end, you'd be barred from ever making progress on the
mainland, and France would eventually overrun you.
Okay, enough of the gloom and doom. I *am* heartened by the fact that you
built as you did, and I am hoping that we can happily go our mostly separate
ways after this season. And obviously a lot of what I am hearing is probably
what you would tell the people I'm hearing it from anyway. Tony clearly needs
us to fight for a chance of staying alive, because that way one of us might
help him against the other, hence his continued agitation for ER fighting.
Much like you last season, I'm just looking for confirmation that we are
following the path we've talked about, and that you are headed to France
while I back off.
> Nice game - damned if we didn't roll over. Glad I was in the car driving
> through wind and rain and snow, so I only had to listen on the radio. . .
I listened to only parts, as I was at a concert. During the breaks between
pieces I'd stick in the headphones to get updates, but was mostly clueless
about what happened in the second half.
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> > >For now, support KIE if you care to; it's not going
> anywhere. I'll write
> > >if that changes.
>
> >Ok, did you decide? Will you go for MUN and support me in KIE?
>
> I am so glad to hear this question. I thought from your first
> message you
> were not interested in a commitment, and it was an ominous feeling.
>
> I've offered support for Kie from the get go. That's not
> changing. I wasn't
> clear that you had a vested interest in me taking Mun. I've certainly
> considered it -- can you tell me why it's important so I can
> add that to my planning.
I am an irresponsible diplomacy player. Until the deadline is very close, I
will often write press without consulting the map. So if I occasionally ask
a question earlier in the phase, like I did that one, feel free to let me
know you don't want to tell me or something; I don't need to know. Don't
worry about it.
> > Clearly Tony is the wild card. What's he told you?
>
> Does it matter? :) He's told me that he'll cut Kie to allow
> me to attack Den,
> if I'll leave him one of Ber or Kie in exchange. I actually
> believe him on
> this, since Ber-Kie is kind of a must for him regardless.
I wonder which of us he's telling the truth. Bizarre, the way he plays.
Good experience for us, to play with a whirling dervish like him. ;-)
> He'll probably also
> try (again) to get you to take Nwy while he thinks he's
> pinned Swe in place.
He is, but in a more roundabout way than in the past. He's really tried
just about everything, from "misdirected" press on down the ladder. . .
> > Hard to say right now - the moves I'm framing out obviously
> don't need
> > coordination with you. Just the support in KIE, as I've said.
>
> Okay. I'll also be moving Swe-Nwy, which puts us in the
> position we had
> discussed (Nwy empty or patrolled by an army), and should
> give you a more
> comfortable feeling about the "FR pincer" than Tony went on
> and on about. I
> think it actually gets me a better defensive position, too.
I agree. Tony has continued arguments along the FR pincer line in group EF
press, which is how I believe he is still trying to persuade me to attack
you.
> I should probably end the Diplomacy part of message here, but
> I just want to
> address one last set of jitters I'm getting this season:
Better you write this then let it worry you. Let's keep the air clear.
> More than one player has told me that you are coming after m.
> Now, one of
> those players has said that every season for the last three,
> but hearing this
> from others is a whole new thing, and it sounds potentially
> credible as I
> hear it from them. Now generally I don't put a lot of weight
> into such things
> because stirring up the pot is part of the game, but it is making me
> concerned.
Positionally it has been pointed out to me that I could attack you, if I
wanted. And you and I are both good enough players that we watch for *good*
opportunities when they arise. So you are wise to keep your ear to the
rail, so to speak. I am curious to know from whom you are hearing these
rumors - as the only power I have suggested this to, was France (um, what
would you have told him in my shoes. . .). Setting aside us and France,
leaving four powers, three of them have repeatedly pled with me to attack
you. Only Andy has not. Turkey's request was the most insistent this
phase, and though this is *true* the reason I write it should speak for
itself.
I have tried to remain noncommittal when receiving such requests, as I do
not want to discourage too firmly an open exchange of ideas. No doubt some
of our neighbors have taken it as a sign that I *would* attack you, which
would be kind of foolish of me, considering it was my *other* neighbor that
just attacked *me*. Still, I can see how they'd believe it; Tony is telling
us and no doubt others that Erik and I had made peace long before I'd even
gotten the first apologetic French press. On this point, my guess is, you
can verify it yourself by looking at the timing of your own private
correspondence with FG, if they kept the pattern with you they kept with me.
> When I look at that and review your messages with a more
> paranoid eye, I note
> that you have not said anything since the builds that would
> preclude your
> discussion being about moving east instead of south, just
> that our moves
> don't need much coordination. I know you tell me not to worry
> about such
> things, but this all combines to make me wonder whether or not you're
> suddently getting coy with me. I have to admit that I am more
> nervous about
> your plans this turn than I have been at any point in the past.
With good reason as I said above. The *moves* are there for me to go either
way, as you can see, and in your position I would feel the same. Keep in
mind what you know of yourself vs. what you know of Erik: which one of you
would *you* rather work with? Which writes more frequently, and more
sensibly? Which provides superior analysis? Which was the one who just
moved to IRI? So, you have to decide again, whether you think I will move
as I told you. In my position, I think you would probably work the ER
alliance. I know that's *my* intention, and it is up to you to decide
whether I am sincere.
> So one more time I'm going to paint the ugly pictures to try
> to calm my own nerves:
You are very nervous for a Californian. ;^)
> Me attacking you: All I could try to do is take Den, but that
> puts me in bad
> position if you were not coming after me because Den-Ska
> means I lose Nwy and
> have to protect StP next year, and I'd never see gains in
> Germany proper
> (you'd see to that). And if I attacked you whle you did move
> against me, it's
> an even worse move. Taking Kie as you suggest is no better, as I'd be
> completely out of position to defend myself from your reprisal.
I agree.
> You attacking me: You could actually take several of my
> centers, but not
> without losing at least one to France for every one you
> gained (I'd see to
> that -- I know Erik is still interested in occupying the isle and out
> growning you).
I can groan with the best of them.
> In the end, you'd be barred from ever making
> progress on the
> mainland, and France would eventually overrun you.
I agree. Also his long silences are making him a difficult companion.
> Okay, enough of the gloom and doom. I *am* heartened by the
> fact that you
> built as you did, and I am hoping that we can happily go our
> mostly separate
> ways after this season. And obviously a lot of what I am
> hearing is probably
> what you would tell the people I'm hearing it from anyway.
> Tony clearly needs
> us to fight for a chance of staying alive, because that way
> one of us might
> help him against the other, hence his continued agitation for
> ER fighting.
> Much like you last season, I'm just looking for confirmation
> that we are
> following the path we've talked about, and that you are
> headed to France while I back off.
Absolutely. I will need builds to make some armies and land them on the
continent. I do not know whether this will call for assistance from you,
but it may at some point soon.
Also - this past weekend I was on the road, including yesterday in heavy
snow driving from Teaneck to Baltimore, with a van full of family. We left
in the morning. This weekend I was borrowing moments at which I could write
from my parents' computer at their house. So if you detected some
irregularity in tone, or thoughtfulness, or perceptiveness, please bear in
mind I was writing in unusually harsh conditions.
> > Nice game - damned if we didn't roll over. Glad I was in
> the car driving
> > through wind and rain and snow, so I only had to listen on
> the radio. . .
>
> I listened to only parts, as I was at a concert. During the
> breaks between
> pieces I'd stick in the headphones to get updates, but was
> mostly clueless about what happened in the second half.
You are being gentlemanly. We came all the way out to Oakland, and urinated
all over the field, and got our butts kicked, and you are being very
gracious about not calling attention to it. God bless you and your family.
;o)
Ben
Message from Italy to Russia
Eric,
> Well, my thinking for IR cooperation was to be in Vie this Spring and then
> look at swinging around towards Jason as we discussed (with much the same
> center distribution), just a season late. That won't work as easily now,
> but is still possible.
Who would be in Vienna this spring?
> I was not kidding in my broadcast about not having any time recently, so I
> haven't looked over the board much at all (I wish I had your FtF experience
> to help here). Because of this I don't have a lot of specific ideas.
You have the world at your feet, EF are fighting, Germany is dead, and
Turkey trusts you completely...
What could possibly be wrong.
> Given my history to date, you are probably skeptical about whether I mean
> any of the above.
Yeah....given that you keep telling me you are making rookie mistakes, and
I know that you are a much better player than that.
On the assumption that you think I'm blowing smoke up
> your you know what, I'll give you a couple of reasons I think you should
> believe me. If you look back at my responses to you last season, I never
> actually said I would tap Bud or Rum, nor move to Arm. I know that's
> largely a lame statement because agreement was implied, but I was very
> careful to not actually promise you something I was afraid I might not
> deliver.
That is fine.
But you set a level of expectation without actually saying the words per
se.
If I have a level of expectation that you have fostered, with direct or
indirect words, we arent in a court of law, you have renighed on your part
of the deal.
I also know that long term someone will need to have fleets in the
> Med to hold whomever comes out of the west in check, and there is no way in
> hell that's going to be me;
Really.
it could be Jason, but there are obvious
> reasons why it would make more sense for me to have it be you there.
Yes...but you have been propping up and working with Jason.....
You reap what you sew.
> Finally, turn after turn I've gotten really strong offers from each of
> Jason and Philippe (that they keep delivering on) that benefit me if I let
> them cooperate against you, so it made sense to me to work with them
> despite our discussions. This season it doesn't look like they are going to
> be able to cooperate against you (at least not in a way that aids me) so
> it's a different environment.
So what makes me believe you wont continue to work with them if they give
you strong offers....
If I have your position, I am already planning my solo....
you are at 7 (which can be 9 anytime you want) and you have no
enemies...sounds like a good place to me.
take care
Andy
Message from Russia to England
> I am an irresponsible diplomacy player.
Whereas I never disappear without notice for a several days at a time like,
oh, last Thursday. :)
> Until the deadline is very close, I will often write press without
> consulting the map.
I've been known to consult the map and see what's not there!
> So if I occasionally ask
> a question earlier in the phase, like I did that one, feel free to let
> me know you don't want to tell me or something; I don't need to know.
> Don't worry about it.
That wasn't my point at all. I have a couple of units that can clearly play
in two different fronts. France has asked me to help him take Mun, Germany
has indicated interest, and there have been various requests around what I
might do in the south. Actually Boh is the one unit that seems to have the
most flexibility. So I meant that comment literally: I did not realize you
had a specific interest in what I do about Mun. I don't recall you asking
about it, so I didn't think I was being coy, I just wanted to hear what you
had to say. Since *you* are the northern player I'm trying to satisfy, I
thought it would be useful to know what you'd like to see there. I do intend
to take Mun, but taking it in Spring was not necessarily a requirement for
me.
> I wonder which of us he's telling the truth. Bizarre, the way he plays.
> Good experience for us, to play with a whirling dervish like him. ;-)
If the past is any indication, neither. I must admit I *really* expected him
to move on Den last season, and was VERY surprised to see that he went to
Holland instead.
> I am curious to know from whom you are hearing these
> rumors - as the only power I have suggested this to, was France (um,
> what would you have told him in my shoes. . .).
Understood.
> Setting aside us and
> France, leaving four powers, three of them have repeatedly pled with me
> to attack you. Only Andy has not. Turkey's request was the most
> insistent this phase, and though this is *true* the reason I write it
> should speak for itself.
The southern powers have not been as direct in their wordings as France, but
I can read the tea leaves with the best of them, especially when they are
pessimistic tea leaves. Philippe has talked of my need (I'll put some
emphasis on that word) to focus on the north several times, enough for
plausible deniability on his part ("I never told Eric anything") yet still
give me the message that I need to get my units moving north. Jason has not
said anything specific, but that's not really his style.
> On this point, my guess is, you
> can verify it yourself by looking at the timing of your own private
> correspondence with FG, if they kept the pattern with you they kept with
> me.
Which they do.
> Keep in
> mind what you know of yourself vs. what you know of Erik: which one of
> you would *you* rather work with?
:) But actually it's the early EF cooperation that makes this hard to guage.
Is Erik just less engaged with me because he's had better rapport with you.
(I know, he just attacked you, but still).
> Which writes more frequently, and more sensibly?
> Which provides superior analysis?
Well, again, I am a very harsh critic of myself, so I think I have unusually
filtered views of the quality of my moves, press and analysis.
> Which was the one who just moved to IRI?
Okay, that one I can give an unbiased answer to! :)
> You are very nervous for a Californian. ;^)
You don't know the half of it! My wife got me a poster that says: "Don't tell
me to relax. The stress is the only thing holding me together." Describes me
pretty well. If I'm not stressed out about anything, I get stressed about the
fact that I'm probably forgetting something.
>> I listened to only parts, as I was at a concert. During the
>> breaks between pieces I'd stick in the headphones to get updates,
>> but was mostly clueless about what happened in the second half.
> You are being gentlemanly. We came all the way out to Oakland, and
> urinated all over the field, and got our butts kicked, and you are
> being very gracious about not calling attention to it.
:) I am very much a "there but for the grace..." kind of guy. I don't kick
people when they are down, because I like to believe they wouldn't/won't kick
me when I'm down. That said, if I knew how your guys blew it, I wouldn't mind
talking about it -- I just wouldn't rub your face in it.
> God bless you and your family.
And yours.
--- Eric
Message from France to Russia
>
> I can't see that me taking Den improves my position at all. I'd lose
> just as
> many units as with a more basic defense, especially if he snuck into Nwy
> while I was taking it. It's not worth the effort in my mind.
That was my feeling, too. I thought I'd offer, though.
>
> > Iri could also stay in place to keep Lvp occupied, but to
> > continue that fight, I'd need a build to ensure F Bre next adjustment
> > period -- this is where support into Munich would help.
>
> This is what I'd like to see. Is it okay if I support you into Mun in
> Fall?
> There's actually a good chance you won't need it at all, but I will make
> sure
> you get it if it is necessary. If you end up in Mun in Spring, I'll want
> support to Ber in Fall.
>
> Does that work for you?
>
Yes, sounds good. I may move Iri out of the way this turn to get Lvp to
head elsewhere, but I haven't decided yet. In any case, support for Mun in
the fall will get you support for Ber; in fact, I'm willing to support you
into Ber regardless. Rather see you take it than England.
Erik
Message from Russia to Italy
Andy,
Unfortunately, I am leaving for my Monday night class in 2 minutes (4:00
Pacific), so it sounds like we will not be able to negotiate specific moves
before the deadline. I will be back just before the deadline (about 7:30
Pacific time, the deadline is 9:30) but I expect that you may be asleep by
then. In general I'm happy with you gaining two centers so long as I can gain
one (or Jason doesn't) at the same time.
If you want to try to get some back and forth before the deadline, send me
some press, but I need to go NOW, so if that's not good enough let's hold off
on cooperation planning until Fall.
Sorry,
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
Please support DEN - KIE & let me know you are doing it.
Thanks.
Ben
Message from Russia to England
> Please support DEN - KIE & let me know you are doing it.
Damn, lost my message in progress.
I'm here and can do this, but would like a confirm back from you to do it.
I assume you realize that Bal S Den-Kie means there is a chance that you
could lose Kie, but I assume you'd look to be in Hel/Nth/Eng at the same
time? Just curious what makes it look better than Den-Hel (which you could do
without me changing my order, and would appear to give much the same result).
I'm here but busy for the next hour. Let me know if this (changing to Bal S
Den-Kie) is a go.
FWIW, I have a message from Erik explicitly stating that he may back Iri off
of Lvp, but then again, he may not. How's that for useful intel? :)
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Russia
I swear I am going insane. I have absolutely no idea what I should be doing.
I have sent in orders (though I know I've been marked as late, that's just
the order delay). I wish I had Andy's confidence; he said he'd be planning
his solo -- I'm still trying to figure out how to stay alive. I told Greg
when I signed up for this game that I would show all the observers exactly
how NOT good I am at this game. Well, I think I'm living up to my word.
Despite apparently controlling much of the diplomatic situation on the board,
I have no frigging idea how to go forward. I'd be interested in the
observers' take on what I should do, since most observers seem to be much
more sure of themselves (even when looking at others' play) than I ever feel.
I think I missed an opportunity by not calling either Jason on his offer of
Ser to Philippe or telling Philippe that Jason offered me support into Bud,
but it's too late now, and I didn't really have time to write anyone anyway.
My moves assume that I can trust both Ben and Philippe to honor their words,
and to be feeding me proper intel on what Jason has told each of them. I will
be honking off Jason incredibly, and Tony mildly, so if they are playing me,
I am basically dead. If I wake up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat,
I may end up changing my orders (if the move hasn't processed yet).
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
Ben,
Here's hoping you wake up before Erik. I've ordered support for Den-Kie. The
move will probably process before I see any response from you, so I hope you
can take advantage of it.
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
One thing I thought goes without saying, but I now realize I hadn't
actually /said/ anyway - I would urge you to do what is in your power to
make MUN *anything* other than French.
Ben
Message from Russia to England
That (keeping Mun from being French) shouldn't be a problem -- at least not
in Spring. And that should be enough info for you to figure out exactly what
I'm doing, I think.
To quote another Eric, "Bon Chance". [Looking at that Eric's position in the
two games I'm watching.] Hmm. Perhaps quoting that Eric isn't the best
portent in the world right now. :)
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> That (keeping Mun from being French) shouldn't be a problem
> -- at least not
> in Spring. And that should be enough info for you to figure
> out exactly what I'm doing, I think.
Interesting. I am expecting Italian A TYR to execute some action in MUN,
but that's more of a hunch than anything.
> To quote another Eric, "Bon Chance". [Looking at that Eric's
> position in the
> two games I'm watching.] Hmm. Perhaps quoting that Eric isn't the best
> portent in the world right now. :)
:-) My (past, not Pinnacle) experience with Eric was C1, of course, and he
advised the Russian player in Teachme3, in which I played Germany, guided by
the estimable Brent Warner. As I read the archive, Eric at one point in
particular delivered a solid blow to my chances there. . . It ended in a
FAR(g) draw - I survived as an unnecessary French puppet in STP. But I
survived. :o)
Anyway, that's what I know from Eric. Also he was eliminated as Italy in
Gutsy2, though I wasn't following that very closely.
While we wait - what exactly do you think Tony will do? It may change my
moves slightly.
Ben
Message from Russia to Italy
Andy,
I'm assuming from before that you are not interested in discussing tactics
this late in the turn, so for now I'll just respond to the message I got from
you last night.
> You have the world at your feet, EF are fighting, Germany is dead, and
> Turkey trusts you completely...
>
> What could possibly be wrong.
I am not asking for your sympathy, but you definitely have a *much* more
optimistic worldview than I did.
> But you set a level of expectation without actually saying the words per
> se.
There is no doubt of that, hence the "lame excuse" caveat.
> Yeah....given that you keep telling me you are making rookie mistakes,
> and I know that you are a much better player than that.
I think I've been poorly expressing the problem. I don't think my mistakes
are generally "rookie" mistakes (with the exception of the Bud support to Ser
thing last season -- in that case I honestly forgot the arrangement of
Gal/Bud/Ser and thought that it was Ser's support that needed to be cut,
hence Gal-Bud was "not effective" -- which was lame if not technically
rookie). I'll try to explain what I mean later, when the explanation isn't
colored by the fact that we're having in-game issues.
> So what makes me believe you wont continue to work with them if they
> give you strong offers....
If they do, then I can't make any such guarantee. My point is that there
isn't as much for them to offer anymore.
> If I have your position, I am already planning my solo....
I believe this, but that's not the way I approach the game (which is a
shortcoming in my game, for certain -- I talk about this some in my comments
to the observers as well). So if you were me, what would you be planning?
(I'm happy for you to respond with a press to self that I can read later -- I
understand you may not want to help me right now). I certainly acknowledge
that to this point I am in good shape despite though I see some serious
errors in judgement and movement on my part, and don't feel the confidence in
my position that I think you would have here.
> you are at 7 (which can be 9 anytime you want) and you have no
> enemies...
That remains to be seen, doesn't it? :) Again, different worldviews....
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
> While we wait - what exactly do you think Tony will do? It may change
> my moves slightly.
Well, that's a tough one. I think it's likely that he will move Ber-Kie, but
I could also see him holding and hoping for your support (don't know if
you've offered it). He could also try moving Ber-Pru if he's really angry
with me, but I don't think he will. For Ruh, I was assuming that he had
offered Ruh-Bel, and that is what caused you to change your request for
support. If he has agreed to that with you, I think it is more likely that he
will move there hoping for your support than that he will do what he's talked
to me about. I have not offered him support into Mun, for what that's worth,
so he's not likely to move there.
But as you say, he is the dervish. If I had a *real* sense of what he was
going to do, I would probably help him acheive it, because just about
anything he wants to accomplish would probably help me by slowing down
France. But I think he's still agreeing to moves to get me to piss you off,
and he's well past my "crying wolf" threshold. There's an outside chance he'd
order support for Bur-Mun. Gets a potential friend in Mun, and if the offer
is believed, it keeps France from attacking Ruh. But if what France has told
me is accurate, he thinks you are coming after me, and wants to be in a
position to benefit from my anger when you do. So I wouldn't think he's
taking Tony's offers of support seriously; he expects to get all the support
he needs from me.
That's all speculation based on nothing more than thinking about the board.
The only firm info I have that I believe is that Tony offered to use Ber
against Kie and that Erik wants Mun in Spring. Oh, and Erik might or might
not vacate Iri. :)
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> Well, that's a tough one. I think it's likely that he will
> move Ber-Kie, but
> I could also see him holding and hoping for your support
> (don't know if
> you've offered it). He could also try moving Ber-Pru if he's
> really angry
> with me, but I don't think he will. For Ruh, I was assuming
> that he had
> offered Ruh-Bel, and that is what caused you to change your
> request for
> support. If he has agreed to that with you, I think it is
> more likely that he
> will move there hoping for your support than that he will do
> what he's talked
signon ec2 elberon
press to i
Andy -
Can you tell me what A TYR is doing?
Ben
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
Thanks for the insight. It's A RUH & A HOL I'm most interested in, of
course. . .
Ben
Message from Russia to England
> signon ec2 elberon
> press to i
> Andy -
> Can you tell me what A TYR is doing?
Whoops! You'll need to change that password. And hey -- if you hear about A
Tyr, do you mind letting me know what he says?
Now I'm off to verify your orders. :) (I hope it's obvious that this is a
joke!)
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Russia
I guess I should comment that in thinking about it, I decided that attacking
Jason may not be the best move. I was considering (and continue to consider)
Sev-Arm, Rum-Sev, Gal-Rum. If Jason is really giving up Ser to Philippe, that
would make it impossible for Philippe to support Jason in, since I'd then
have a retreat to Bud (or he'd have to give me Vie to cover that retreat). It
would also force Jason to consider Bla-Ank, and Eas/Aeg-Smy, and may allow me
to build a second fleet. However, if Jason really is supporting me to Bud and
I attack him instead, then I'm likely to lose Rum to combined AT pressure,
while sabotaging my relationship with Jason, which would be really bad. So
I've scuttled the Turkish attack, for now at least.
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> > Andy -
> > Can you tell me what A TYR is doing?
>
> Whoops! You'll need to change that password. And hey -- if
> you hear about A
> Tyr, do you mind letting me know what he says?
>
> Now I'm off to verify your orders. :) (I hope it's obvious
> that this is a joke!)
>
> --- Eric
Cripes!
Ben
Message from England to Russia
Oops! My password's changed! Let's try again:
Eric -
Nothing from Andy yet.
By the way - you did not acknowledge my return on your _Princess Bride_
serve. . .
Busily reading the ecstatic reviews for _Return of the King_ - I should
probably do some work before I go home.
*yawn*
Would you order BAL - KIE instead, please? I'm fiddling around at the last
minute. I don't know whether it will help, but it won't hurt, I don't
think.
Ben
Message from Russia to England
> By the way - you did not acknowledge my return on your _Princess Bride_
> serve. . .
Well, since I've spent my last few messages describing the errors of waging a
land war in Asia, I thought I had done my part. <rimshot>
> Busily reading the ecstatic reviews for _Return of the King_
We won't be seeing RotK for another week probably -- our holidays are all
this week and weekend, and we don't expect to breathe for another few days
still. And despite having read the books, I'm a spoiler-phobe. Probably won't
read reviews until after the first viewing.
> Would you order BAL - KIE instead, please? I'm fiddling around at the
> last minute. I don't know whether it will help, but it won't hurt, I
> don't think.
Is there an important reason? I really don't want to lose my fleet from Bal
if I don't have to. If I did inadvertently end up in Kie, it becomes dicey
whether I can get the support to take Ber in Fall. I think fleets in Bal and
Hel are important for us to project enough power into the northern coast,
with all the FG armies that we're facing. They have two levels (coast and
inland) of support, so we need two levels of support on our end to be able to
make way against them -- or at least that's how I see it.
For now I have *not* changed my order, but let me know what you are thinking
if it is important. I'm taking the "I'm fiddling" to mean that this isn't a
critical change you are asking for, and so assume this stance is not a slap
in the face of any sort.
--- Eric
Message from Italy to Russia
Eric,
> I'm assuming from before that you are not interested in discussing tactics
> this late in the turn, so for now I'll just respond to the message I got from
> you last night.
I try to stand by the rule of not negotiating with anyone that doesnt have
thier moves in and is late....
> > You have the world at your feet, EF are fighting, Germany is dead, and
> > Turkey trusts you completely...
> >
> > What could possibly be wrong.
>
> I am not asking for your sympathy, but you definitely have a *much* more
> optimistic worldview than I did.
Ok....who wants you dead.....that can actually get to you and be
effective.
> > Yeah....given that you keep telling me you are making rookie mistakes,
> > and I know that you are a much better player than that.
>
>
> If they do, then I can't make any such guarantee. My point is that there
> isn't as much for them to offer anymore.
Really....but in a year or so, it wont matter what they are offering, you
will be able to take what you want.
> > If I have your position, I am already planning my solo....
>
> I believe this, but that's not the way I approach the game (which is a
> shortcoming in my game, for certain -- I talk about this some in my comments
> to the observers as well). So if you were me, what would you be planning?
I will write a press to myself.
> > you are at 7 (which can be 9 anytime you want) and you have no
> > enemies...
>
> That remains to be seen, doesn't it? :) Again, different worldviews....
I guess so....but I would be very interested in who you call an enemy
right now.
Andy
Message from Russia to Italy
> I try to stand by the rule of not negotiating with anyone that doesnt
> have thier moves in and is late....
Me too. And to be clear, I'm not late at this point. I was about 30 minutes
late in submitting orders last night. I wasn't late because I was stalling
for negotation time. I meant that you said before that you disregard
negotiations that happen right before the deadline. And since the deadline
could effectively be now, I assumed that this "break" would count as "right
before" it.
>>> If I have your position, I am already planning my solo....
>>
>> So if you were me, what would you be planning?
>
> I will write a press to myself.
Thanks, I appreciate it.
>>> you are at 7 (which can be 9 anytime you want) and you have no
>>> enemies...
>>
>> That remains to be seen, doesn't it? :) Again, different worldviews....
>
> I guess so....but I would be very interested in who you call an enemy
> right now.
There is no one that is actively acting as such. But as someone said on some
diplomacy list recently, it's like the stock market -- past performance is
not a guarantee of future returns. As I said, it truly is a worldview kind of
thing. I suspect we would both come up with somewhat similar reviews of any
given board as observers, but that the expectations that we would bring to
actually playing a specific position would differ significantly. In this
respect, I'm a "glass half empty" kind of guy.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Turkey
Hey Jason,
Just checking in, given that we've got extra time now.
Are you still okay with me taking Bud? I got a weird message from Philippe
that didn't jibe with what we've talked about. If you want to talk about
different moves, let me know. And I'm still planning on you taking Rum in the
long term.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
I haven't heard back from you, and will need to leave shortly. I'm assuming
Bal S Den-Kie is still good enough.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Russia
Well, with all the extra time, it certainly gives me more stewing
opportunities. I'm comfortable with Ben -- if he's trying to fool me he's
done a fantastic job.
I'm a little concerned that Jason might go with Ser-Rum, Bla and Bul
supporting. With me moving Gal-Bud that's an ugly combination. I go down two,
Jason gets a serious foot in my door, and lots of builds. I've considered
(and actually changed my order to and from) Gal S Rum about three times now.
It would certainly answer why Jason is okay with me going to Bud, but
Philippe expects to move to Ser unopposed. I'm just afraid that supporting
myself in place is too defensive. I can afford to lose Rum in the Fall, if
I'm getting a center, but not in the Spring. So I guess I'll be changing that
order again.
Of course, if it's planned between AT, then Vie-Gal or Bud-Gal gets it for
them anyway, but there's not much I can do about that. We shall see.
--- Eric
Message from Turkey to Russia
Hey Eric,
Don't worry about Philippe - he's just passing on disinformation. You're
on for support into Bud, and I'm good with taking Rum in the fall.
Thanks for the info on Philippe, though. Nice to know who's talking to whom.
jason
Message from England to Russia
Pretty soon I'm giving up and changing my password /back/. Here goes again:
Eric -
> > By the way - you did not acknowledge my return on your _Princess Bride_
> > serve. . .
>
> Well, since I've spent my last few messages describing the errors of
waging a
> land war in Asia, I thought I had done my part. <rimshot>
You deserve the rimshot. Nice one. But you're no match for my brains.
> > Busily reading the ecstatic reviews for _Return of the King_
>
> We won't be seeing RotK for another week probably -- our holidays are all
> this week and weekend, and we don't expect to breathe for another few days
> still. And despite having read the books, I'm a spoiler-phobe. Probably
won't
> read reviews until after the first viewing.
Understandable.
> > Would you order BAL - KIE instead, please? I'm fiddling around at the
> > last minute. I don't know whether it will help, but it won't hurt, I
> > don't think.
>
> Is there an important reason? I really don't want to lose my fleet from
Bal
> if I don't have to. If I did inadvertently end up in Kie, it becomes dicey
> whether I can get the support to take Ber in Fall. I think fleets in Bal
and
> Hel are important for us to project enough power into the northern coast,
> with all the FG armies that we're facing. They have two levels (coast and
> inland) of support, so we need two levels of support on our end to be
able to
> make way against them -- or at least that's how I see it.
>
> For now I have *not* changed my order, but let me know what you are
thinking
> if it is important. I'm taking the "I'm fiddling" to mean that this isn't
a
> critical change you are asking for, and so assume this stance is not a
slap
> in the face of any sort.
Don't change your order. That way I don't have to make up my mind.
Ben
Message from Russia to Turkey
Sounds good. Ser for me, then Rum for you. Next year we should be able to
take Tri and Vie, then it's spaghetti and pizza for you. :)
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Turkey
> Sounds good. Ser for me, then Rum for you. Next year we should be able to
> take Tri and Vie, then it's spaghetti and pizza for you. :)
Note to self: don't write press after midnight -- especially following office
parties that involve alchohol. Obviously I meant Bud, not Ser.
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
If Erik does go abandoned, I am not really comfortable with the thought of you replacing him again. Please do not be offended when I ask, is it ok for someone else to have a turn.
Ben
Message from Russia to England
> Eric -
> If Erik does go abandoned, I am not really comfortable with the thought
> of you replacing him again. Please do not be offended when I ask, is it
> ok for someone else to have a turn.
Context please?
I'm sure I'm just being stupid here (remember: I am no match for your brains)
but I have no idea what you are talking about. I'd guess it's a joke or
misdirected press, because I obviously can't replace another player in the
same game. But it sounds so sincere that I think you might really mean it.
--- Eric
P.S. Anybody want a peanut?
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> > If Erik does go abandoned, I am not really comfortable with the thought
> > of you replacing him again. Please do not be offended when I ask, is it
> > ok for someone else to have a turn.
>
> Context please?
Hm. I wrote this earlier at the office party, where I'd been drinking. I
had thought you came in as a sort of endgame replacement for Erik in C1,
but no doubt it was the alcohol. Sorry!
> same game. But it sounds so sincere that I think you might really mean it.
>
> --- Eric
>
> P.S. Anybody want a peanut?
Enough already!
Ben
Message from Russia to England
>> P.S. Anybody want a peanut?
>Enough already!
Must...resist...urge to respond...with..."As you wish".....
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> Must...resist...urge to respond...with..."As you wish".....
Ok.
Maybe you could write it tomorrow, if you want.
Ben
Message from France to all
Sorry, all. I had a big issue involving my e-mail provider that has now
been fixed.
Erik
Austria: Army Budapest → Serbia (*bounce, dislodged*)
Austria: Fleet Trieste → Albania
Austria: Army Vienna SUPPORT Fleet Trieste (*void*)
England: Fleet Denmark → Helgoland Bight
England: Fleet Kiel → Holland (*bounce*)
England: Fleet Liverpool → Irish Sea
England: Fleet London → English Channel
England: Fleet North Sea SUPPORT Fleet Kiel → Holland
France: Army Belgium SUPPORT Army Holland
France: Army Burgundy → Ruhr (*bounce*)
France: Army Gascony → Marseilles
France: Army Holland SUPPORT Army Belgium (*cut*)
France: Fleet Irish Sea → Mid-Atlantic Ocean
France: Fleet Marseilles → Gulf of Lyon
France: Fleet Spain (south coast) → Western Mediterranean (*bounce*)
Germany: Army Berlin → Kiel (*bounce*)
Germany: Army Ruhr → Holland (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Ionian Sea → Greece (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Naples → Tyrrhenian Sea
Italy: Fleet Tunis → Western Mediterranean (*bounce*)
Italy: Army Tyrolia SUPPORT Austrian Army Vienna
Italy: Army Venice → Rome
Russia: Fleet Baltic Sea SUPPORT English Fleet Denmark → Kiel (*void*)
Russia: Army Bohemia → Munich
Russia: Army Galicia → Budapest
Russia: Fleet Rumania SUPPORT Turkish Army Bulgaria
Russia: Army Sevastopol SUPPORT Fleet Rumania
Russia: Army Silesia → Berlin (*bounce*)
Russia: Army Sweden → Norway
Turkey: Fleet Aegean Sea → Greece
Turkey: Fleet Black Sea SUPPORT Army Bulgaria
Turkey: Army Bulgaria SUPPORT Fleet Aegean Sea → Greece
Turkey: Army Serbia SUPPORT Russian Army Galicia → Budapest
Turkey: Fleet Smyrna → Aegean Sea
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