|
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
Greetings. Good morning? Trying to count off the hours from Eastern U.S.
to Holland - forgive me if I'm wrong but I'm guessing you are reading this
early a.m.
I recognized your e-mail immediately from the Vermont Group so I went to the
official list to see how many of us are members. Would you believe. . . .
six. All of us but Jason Bennett in Turkey. Hopefully there won't be a
problem with dropouts. Doug would be disappointed.
Concerning Belgium I would like to get it in '01 but that is negotiable.
The door for long-term planning is open. Let's hear from our other
neighbors & figure out something good for us both.
Here we go!
Ben
Message from France to Germany
German leader:
Greetings and salutations. As your immediate neighbor, I didn't want to
waste any time introducing myself and establishing some kind of dialogue.
I'm still trying to get the lay of the land, so I don't have any specific
requests or suggestions right now, but there's obviously a lot of
potential for cooperation between the two of us. I know a few of the
players here in the West, and I'll be happy to share what a I know about
them, but the East is sort of a mystery.
Ben Harris, the English player, was a commentator in the last comments
game, in which I played Germany. He seems like a sharp guy with some good
insight into the game. Andy, the Italian player, just whipped me in
another game, so I'm quite familiar with his style of play (and hopefully,
I won't be making the same mistakes twice).
Let me know when you get your embassies cranking, and we can try to hash
out some sort of early plan. I assume you're headed for Holland and
Denmark; as far as I'm concerned, Belgium is open to discussion, and
something that should be resolved sooner rather than later.
Erik
Message from Italy to Germany
Tony.....how are things.
What direction do you see things moving, and do you think we can work
together out of the gate....
let me know
Andy
Message from Germany to England
Hi Ben, I forgive you, I just received your press and its 22:16 p.m.
Message to all
Is this our Eric? playing Russia?
ID Email Name JDPR Rating JDPR
Games JDPR Rank
1791 ericg (at) mac.com Eric Goodman 1349.00 5
288 8 0 8.00
What is Jason's JDPR? I couldnt find him.
This must be our Benjamin:
ID Email Name JDPR Rating JDPR Games JDPR Rank RR Games RR Resignations
RR Ratio
6887 benjamin.harris (at) mindspring.com Ben Harris 1012.00 4 3835 4 0
4.00
Message from Germany to France
Hello Eric, greetings to you to neighbour....
> I didn't want to waste any time introducing myself and establishing some
kind of dialogue>
I too agree that everyone has a right to your opinion
> I'm still trying to get the lay of the land>
Good to hear, watch out for rocks and lose dirt it can be dangerous out
there.
> so I don't have any specific requests or suggestions right now, but
there's obviously a lot of potential for cooperation between the two of us>
When I have some concrete details to discuss I wont hesitate to share them
with you. As you point out the potential is definitely there. Lets ask
around and make our plans more definitive.
>I know a few of the players here in the West, and I'll be happy to share
what a I know about them, but the East is sort of a mystery.>
By all means do, I tend to let the situation in the world (created by
everyones actions) dictate my strategy. Stab me once, stab me twice even a
3rd time and if the situation calls for it I will make you my trusty ally
and we will stab your enemy together.
> Ben Harris, the English player, was a commentator in the last comments>
We have just been intoduced. My final p.s. to him was ;
p.s. OK, I will not eliminate you before the end op '01 and I will take your
desire for Belgium to heart in negotiations with my neighbours. Should
France have the same desire regarding Belgium then I am more than willing to
act as a go between. The world is large enough for the three of us.
> Let me know when you get your embassies cranking, and we can try to hash
out some sort of early plan. I assume you're headed for Holland and
Denmark; as far as I'm concerned, Belgium is open to discussion, and
something that should be resolved sooner rather than later.>
For now I have only spoken to England he wants Belgium as you can see from
my p.s. to him, he did however add that it was open to negotiation. If you
and I take objection to this then we must discuss the matter further.
Dont judge me on your previous moves (when you played GErmany ;-),
I have no need to bounce in BUR unless you request me to do so nor will i go
there.
Once I have spoken to Italy, austria and the rest of the world I will give
you a run down of how I see things unfolding.
Lets keep in touch. For now I only have growth on my mind (1 or 2). I havent
yet decided where to grab this growth this year or spread it over next year
as well.
When I do I will let you know. My objective will be based on what I hear. In
the meantime let me know how you wish to discuss belgium. Do we bend over
and let England take it or just give him that impression.
Thanks for your insight into the other players, I will take it into account.
But once again the board usually dictates my actions and diplomacy.
Tony
Message from Germany to Italy
Hi Andy, great to see a familiar name.
As for now I have only spoken to England, France and yourself.
Nothing much from England except his desire for Belgium. France wishes to
talk to his neighbours before putting any suggestions forward.
As for straight out of the gate....... A little protection is always helpful
and you never know when you may need it.
If you and Austria get off to a good start then any pressure on France is
welcome. I wont lie about that. Let me know how things go out east. Look
after yourself first. If you feel any jump start is worth serious
consideration then let me know. I will do the same. As for now I am doing
the usual rounds, will get back to you asap with any value adding
information.
Tony
Message from Germany to England
Hi again Ben, this is a follow up to our time stamp check ;-)
>Hopefully there won't be a problem with dropouts.>
I agree they are a bunch of dropouts at the Vermont Group ;-) that's what
binds us.
But they are reliable for seeing it through to the end.
>Concerning Belgium I would like to get it in '01 but that is negotiable. >
Thank you for sharing your concerns and desires with me in regard to
Belgium.
I was hoping to eliminate you before the end of '01 but who am I to brush
away concerns and desires.
I am very pleased to hear that you are not blinded by need and that
negotiations can be conducted.
>The door for long-term planning is open. Let's hear from our other
neighbors & figure out something good for us both.>
A year is indeed a long time in diplomacy so lets discuss Belgium in the
near future after speaking to neighbours, close and far. Once I have tasted
the situation around the world I will get back to you with concrete
suggestions for the good of us both.
Good hunting. May we live long and prosper.
p.s. OK, I will not eliminate you before the end op '01 and I will take your
desire for Belgium to heart in negotiations with my neighbours. Should
France have the same desire regarding Belgium then I am more than willing to
act as a go between. The world is large enough for the three of us.
Message from Germany to all
Greetings all, Just thought that I would let you know that I wish to solo
and that I hope to have a good time whilst doing so.
I will have to make Belgium my 18th SC as England has desires for it. It is
negotiable according to England but hey
if he wants it then I will take Beligium last. It wont matter then.
Anyone else have any wishes. If not then all just vote me the winner and we
can move on.
I am easy, if two of you have the same solo wish then hey lets compromise
;-)
May you all live for as long as you want and never want for as long as you
live.
Tony
p.s. Its bedtime here in holland (Ben its 00:03 a.m. now), will get back to
A,T, R tomorrow.
Message from Master to all
Players,
The game has now started, powers have been assigned and the opening
salvos have been fired. I think we've got a great group of players in
this game, so I'm sure it will be a great experience for all of you
and for our commentators.
One of our players will be gone for a week from the 10th to the 18th.
I'm hoping that we can complete our first year before that hiatus.
Just to let you know, right now we've got over twenty commentators. I
expect that a few more will trickle in over the next few days.
Also, each Spring, as early as I can, I'm going to broadcast the
following message. After the first few years, I might cut back to once
every second year. I just want to make sure no one forgets about this.
------------
Players,
Please keep in mind that if you'd like to share your plans, strategy
and whatnot with the commentators, you can do that by sending press to
yourself. That way the commentators will see your comments, but other
players will not. If you send "press to o", anyone can see your
comments by requesting a history of the game. If you send "press to
m", I will see your comments but the commentators will not.
You are not required to share information with the commentators, but
you are encouraged to do so.
Greg, GM
C2
-------------
I'd like to wish everyone the best of luck in the game - have a great
game everyone.
Greg, GM
C2
Message from Austria to Germany
Hi Tony,
My first letter goes to you as I have a great need of
my German brother. While we both sit in the middle
of, soon to be, war torn Europe, with all the inherent
dangers of such positions, I'm already under the threat
of invasion by italians armies sitting just the other side
of my border.
I will of course do my best to insure the safety of my
people, but if I were to fail, you would find yourself
surrounded by powers that might be hostile to you
whereas I don't have the luxury or the desire to (Our
most effective paths of expansion lies in opposite
directions and the list of contested sc would be limited
to three: Marseilles, Warsaw & Moscow. A very small
list compare to other countries; wich make potential
conflicts between us very easy to handle and quite
unprobable until late in the game).
Given the mutual benefit of seeing the other survive
to protect our backs, I'm hoping that you will accept
to provide me with some diplomatic cover toward
Italy & Russia. Specifically, I would like you to keep
an army in Munich this year, to help repel a possible
italian invasion, and send your fleet to Denmark, to
deny Sweden to Russia if he has proven himself
hostile to us.
Once Russia & Italy are made of aware of this, it is
doubtfull they would entertained any hostiles actions
toward us and it should be easier for us to deal with
them.
Hope to hear from you soon as the rest of my
diplomacy depend on your answer,
Philippe
Message from Russia to all
>[Grey] Broadcast message in 'c2':
>Is this our Eric? playing Russia?
Da, dat's me, Tovarich. But watz wit' all the hush-hush secret
stuff? You messin' wit' me? Why doncha come out where's I can see ya,
huh?
--- Tzarface
Message from Russia to Germany
Tony,
I am fully on board with the German solo angle. But I find that
misdirection works really well to set these things up. I suggest you
open Mun-Bur-Gas, Kie-Den-Nth, and Ber-Kie-Hol. I'll open
War-Sil-Mun, take Swe and go Mos-War-Sil. Then when I suddenly go
south, you'll mop up in the intervening confusion. The only downside
is that you might have to take Bel before you're at 18, but I'm
hoping you can be flexible on that point.
More seriously, I've read a lot of articles that claim that GR is a
dangerous combination for both players -- for Germany because Russia
is always "behind" him and for Russia because of the proximity of a
lot of Germany units and the "inevitable" clash in Scandinavia. My
experience (and I have a whole 2 games' worth to speak from!) is that
GR is very effective. With Russia sufficiently engaged in the south
and Germany in the west, it can be pursued with a relative minimum of
stress for both players.
So I'm hopeful that we can work together in the long term and am very
willing to discuss options for such cooperation. In the shorter term
I'd like us to agree to something simple like a DMZ in Pru and Sil. I
would also like to know your intentions with respect to Sweden. Of
course I expect to take it StP-Bal-Swe, but it's always nice to know
what the German player is thinking before making assumptions about
the success of such a venture.
--- Tzarface
Message from Russia to Germany
>Of course I expect to take it StP-Bal-Swe, but it's always nice to
>know what the German player is thinking before making assumptions
>about the success of such a venture.
Actually, considering legal moves helps as well! Obviously I meant StP-Bot-Swe.
--- Tzarface
Message from England to all
> This must be our Benjamin:
> Ben Harris 1012.00
I just want to point out, that my JDPR is within several percentage points
of Andy's, at 1085. Therefore I am pretty much as good as Andy Bartalone,
who is well known in some circles as a player who uses ellipses very
frequently. . .
Also I want to point out that Greg's JDPR of 1431 is highest of all of us,
and I think we should gang up on him and fix the game settings so we all
solo.
Finally I want Tony to know that Belgium is his, if he will but send me a
case of that weird fruit flavored beer they have there.
Thank you.
Ben
Message to all
> >[Grey] Broadcast message in 'c2':
> >Is this our Eric? playing Russia?
>
> Da, dat's me, Tovarich. But watz wit' all the hush-hush secret
> stuff? You messin' wit' me? Why doncha come out where's I can see ya,
> huh?
No.....Eric Hunter played Russia in the first game...not Eric Goodman...
But Eric is every bit as good as his namesake.
Message from Italy to all
>
> > This must be our Benjamin:
> > Ben Harris 1012.00
>
> I just want to point out, that my JDPR is within several percentage points
> of Andy's, at 1085. Therefore I am pretty much as good as Andy Bartalone,
> who is well known in some circles as a player who uses ellipses very
> frequently. . .
Be careful what you say.....everyone here knows that I suck at this game.
> Also I want to point out that Greg's JDPR of 1431 is highest of all of us,
> and I think we should gang up on him and fix the game settings so we all
> solo.
Ok....I dont want to be part of that.....see Greg...I am not a
mutineer...:-)
> Finally I want Tony to know that Belgium is his, if he will but send me a
> case of that weird fruit flavored beer they have there.
That would be Lambic.
Message from Turkey to all
Good to hear from everyone. I'm afraid I don't have a JDPR, although
it's not for lack of trying! All my games have completed since Jan 1 of
this year.
Looking forward to it....
jason
Message from Germany to Germany
**I sent this last night but to the wrong server**
OK, I have just heared from Andy (Italy). Just the usual greeting and best
wishes. He didnt mention anything shocking about his talks carried out so
far. He has only spoken to england and russia. I informed him to talk to me
after he spoke to turkey and austria and you. He asked if I had any out of
the gate suggestions. I said I had only talked to you and england and that I
would get back to him with any value added information which I come across.
Lets finish the round off and cross check all information so far.
Message from Russia to all
> > >[Grey] Broadcast message in 'c2':
> > >Is this our Eric? playing Russia?
> >
> > Da, dat's me, Tovarich. But watz wit' all the hush-hush secret
> > stuff? You messin' wit' me? Why doncha come out where's I can see ya,
> > huh?
>
>No.....Eric Hunter played Russia in the first game...not Eric Goodman...
>
>But Eric is every bit as good as his namesake.
Lemme 'splain, 'cuz youse havin some trouble gettin' dem fax straight, see.
#1- I'm Eric. That other Eric, I'm his namesake. Just 'cuz he's been dippin
longer dan me an doin bedder dan me don't make him da original guy.
#2- Da first inkwyry was askin' if da' guy playin' Russia (dat's me,
comrade) is da same guy whatz got da ID dat he showed in da broadcast.
Since I'z da guy what used ta have da "@mac.com" moniker, he was inkwyrin'
about me, not dat udder Eric guy.
#3- Since I'z da one what said I'z da' guy what da udder guy was askin'
about, whatcha' doin' contradiktin' me in fronna' my whole family fer?
Alla dis disrepectin, an ya ain't even got da constatushun ta come out an
talk ta me face ta face. Sheesh! Watz da world comin' to, anyway?
--- Tzarface
Message from Germany to Austria
Hi Philippe,
>My first letter goes to you as I have a great need of my German brother. While we both sit in the middle
of, soon to be, war torn Europe, with all the inherent dangers of such positions, I'm already under the threat
of invasion by italians armies sitting just the other side of my border.>
Who informed you of my plans to attack europe, or did the open solo broadcast give me away ;-)
As for Italy, I have always found AI once they have found each other to be a very reliable force to be reckoned with. I am sure the Italian will be knocking at your door carrying an olive branch. I have already spoken to him and urged him (in my own interest) to not war with you. I am sure the two of you have enough to worry about, you dont want a juggernaut rolling your way. I am hoping that this may allow VEN to come to my aid should EF take a fancy to my country. Maybe you can stear the AI alliance in this direction of cooperation.
>I will of course do my best to insure the safety of my people, but if I were to fail, you would find yourself surrounded by powers that might be hostile to you whereas I don't have the luxury or the desire to (Our most effective paths of expansion lies in opposite directions and the list of contested sc would be limited to three: Marseilles, Warsaw & Moscow. A very small list compare to other countries; wich make potential
conflicts between us very easy to handle and quite unprobable until late in the game).>
I have no reason to believe that we will be in conflict now or in the near future.
> Given the mutual benefit of seeing the other survive to protect our backs, I'm hoping that you will accept
to provide me with some diplomatic cover toward Italy & Russia. Specifically, I would like you to keep
an army in Munich this year, to help repel a possible italian invasion, and send your fleet to Denmark, to
deny Sweden to Russia if he has proven himself hostile to us.>
Your suggestions have been noted, for now EFRIA have all made suggestions concerning my troop movements.
> Once Russia & Italy are made of aware of this, it is doubtfull they would entertained any hostiles actions
toward us and it should be easier for us to deal with them.>
As I said, make friends with Italy. I will send a press to you both expressing my desires for your union.
> Hope to hear from you soon as the rest of my diplomacy depend on your answer>
Lets do our rounds and get back to each other.
Tony
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
To AIG, a toast.....may our cooporation blossom. Together we form a strong centre with enough expansion possibilities without antagonising each other. Our backs are covered. Let us erect a shrine in TYR and may it never come crumbling down.
Message from Germany to Russia
Hello Tzarface,
>More seriously, I've read a lot of articles that claim that GR is a dangerous combination for both players -- for Germany because Russia is always "behind" him and for Russia because of the proximity of a
lot of Germany units and the "inevitable" clash in Scandinavia. My experience (and I have a whole 2 games' worth to speak from!) is that GR is very effective. With Russia sufficiently engaged in the south
and Germany in the west, it can be pursued with a relative minimum of stress for both players.>
Aahh stress, indeed something to be avoided. With a friendly GR Russia even has the luxury to exploit possibilities in the north. My gut feeling combined with signals received from AI tells me that RT will do ok in the south. I would like you to consider a northern approach with MOS going to STP. The more you grab in the north, the lesse you need in the south/south west to solo.
> So I'm hopeful that we can work together in the long term and am very willing to discuss options for such cooperation. In the shorter term I'd like us to agree to something simple like a DMZ in Pru and Sil. I
would also like to know your intentions with respect to Sweden. Of course I expect to take it StP-Bot-Swe, but it's always nice to know what the German player is thinking before making assumptions about
the success of such a venture.>
A logical set of moves for the fleet in STP. I would ofcourse prefer to see the fleet move onto NWY. This could be achieved by spring next year as the army in STP would force england to use NTH/NWG to take sweden. If STP were then to move to Finland then a fleet build in STP will have you on your way into Sweden and the NWG. With two fleets facing England. If Austria moves against you then I would come to your aid. I think a move to UKR from WAR and MOS to STP will still ensure that Austria wont go for WAR even if he makes it to GAL. Push for a DMZ in GAL. With the eternal bounce in BLA along with my offered support if you get into trouble with Austria would leave us free to concentrate on England and scandinavia.
Just a few thoughts. Lets do our rounds and evaluate what we have heared and take appropiate steps from there. So far I have only been asked to bounce in Sweden should the situation call for it. This came from Austria, this is what leads me to belive that you would be able to arrange a DMZ in GAL and work together with me in the north. I will talk to Austria and point out the RG cooporation talks and inform him that if he does move on GAL once agreeing on a DMZ that I shall have to come to your aid.
Message from Germany to England
Hello Ben *timestamp* sent at 10:10 a.m.
So how are negotiations going? I have spoken to all my neighbours now. I just have Turkey left.
Italy mentioned that he had spoken to you and directly asked me if GI had plans from the gate.
I can only assume that he was referring to your intention on moving on BEL. Maybe he sees this as a possible E against F which he maybe would like to combine with a GI against France.
I informed him that I was still making my rounds. I got the impression that AI are friendly as ar RT. I have yet to speak to Turkey so I cant confirm this. The French asked me to discuss Belgium with him. This was before he knew that you had an eye on Belgium. A french interest for Belgium is usually used as a springboard for a convoy to england or an eventual attack on Gemany. How are negotiations going on the ENG channel?
It may also mean that he just wants to know my intention with Belgium. Usually a german invasion of Belgium spells trouble for France or s solid front line between the two nations to allow the other to look elsewhere.
Taking the Italians comments into account an EG friendship seems the most likely. I guess you will have to wait and see how the Russian opens. If he is friendly with Turkey then I can only assume that Austria is the intended target. This gives you and I room to manouvre in the north. Lets see how it goes. I dont mind you getting BEL but I would obviously only like to see a fleet there. Maybe an opening edi - nwg, lon - nth, lvp - edi would leave all options open for you. But I would only allow a fleet into Belgium.
Message from Germany to France
Well I have spoken to all my neighbours now, only Turkey left.
So far I have concluded that the Englishman will want Belgium. To do this he may go for the ENG and NTH. I have informed it that if anything only a fleet of his would be welcome. To ensure this he has to go for ENG. Just thought I would let you know. Italy seems friendly with Austria as does Russia with Turkey but I have yet to speak to the Turk. RA also seem reasonably friendly judging by the seperate press I received and after putting two and two together. This leads me to believe that Russia may open to the north. This may leave open up an opportunity for you and me in the west. AI will no doubt go after Turkey unless Italy has been convinced that GIT against France is a reasonable alternative for his VEN army if he is frinedly with Austria.
An english fleet in Belgium spells trouble for you, an english army in bel spells trouble for me as does a french army. I say cut the red tape and take POR and SPA using your armys. I will cover BEL if need be from RUH and push my fleet into holland and an army into denmark as you did last game. Only this time we will finish england off and not stop until we do so. Let me know what you think and what you have found out.
Message from Germany to all
> Finally I want Tony to know that Belgium is his, if he will but send me a
case of that weird fruit flavored beer they have there.<
Ah, you mean a case of the "forbidden drink", consider it done. Thank you for giving me BEL as my 18th center.
Message from Germany to Turkey
Hi Jason, glad to hear you are not the "jason" aka Jason Whitby.
So fellow witch, how are negotiations going? when playing Turkey I always try to get the juggernaut off to a good start. It is also in my interest that that is the case this time. Not that my interest is your top priority but in this case we have a mutual interest in a good old RT alliance.
He may want to open north and I dont mind him opening north. Lets keep each other informed. I have spoken to both AI and they do seem friendly towards each other, be careful out there.
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
Hi again, I have spoken to all powers now and have received input back from them. Going by the first comment game though the spring moves were a surprise to most. I wonder if that will be the case in this game.
How are you two getting on? do you need any specific feedback from my round of talks?
For now I am sticking to my GIA as the best line of defence, we can watch each others back.
Message from Austria to Germany
Hi Tony,
Thank you for your kind words, but I was hoping for
something more concrete. Sweet talking Italy & Russia
into leaving me alone, and even work with me, sure is
something I have to do; but if they decide that taking
me out is their best option to solo, it's not going to stop
them from doing so; and neither are your own words if
they aren't backed by a capacity to actually do something
about it.
I understand that you prefer to keep your options open,
but can you at least give me Kie-Den to work with?
Whatever you decide for the rest of your units, this
would still give you a very flexible positionning.
Philippe
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
>
> To AIG, a toast.....may our cooporation blossom. Together we form a
strong centre with enough expansion possibilities without antagonising
each other. Our backs are covered. Let us erect a shrine in TYR and may
it never come crumbling down.
>
An excellent sentiment. I agree whole-heartedly.
Message from Italy to Germany
> Message from tvernon@chello.nl as Germany to Austria and Italy in 'c2':
>
> Hi again, I have spoken to all powers now and have received input back
from them. Going by the first comment game though the spring moves were
a surprise to most. I wonder if that will be the case in this game.
I have sent press to everyone on the board, the only person I havent heard
a word from is Austria.
How are you two getting on? do you need any specific feedback from my
round of talks?
I dont know, I havent heard a word from him, but i know RT and F have.
> For now I am sticking to my GIA as the best line of defence, we can
watch each others back.
>
sounds like a great plan...assuming the Austrian actually talks to me.
Andy
Message from Turkey to Germany
Thanks for your note.
Russia and I have been talking, but I'm not too high on a full RT
alliance. Too many people looking for it, and ready to scream about it.
Don't worry, I'm covering my back, and I'll see what I can do about
Leptanoism.
jason
Message from Germany to Austria
Hi Philippe,
I thought that we would make our rounds and then get back to each other with more concrete measures.
> I understand that you prefer to keep your options open,
but can you at least give me Kie-Den to work with? Whatever you decide for the rest of your units, this
would still give you a very flexible positionning.>
I am still in the middle of talks, even to the point where I am asking AR to work with you.
For now Russia and I are coming to terms regarding yours and his interacting in my eyes and my first impressions following a round of talks. As you know I have suggested to you and Italy that we work together.
A normal opening for germany would be to den, kie and BUR or RUH depending on negotiations and gut feelings.
If I feel all is going well with england then KIE to DEN will be the move to make. I wish things to go well with both E and F. All Russia has asked is that I dont bounce him in Sweden, I did point out to him that this has been suggested as a course of action if certain situations arise. We spoke openly about it. I did state that I would like to see TYR empty, this not only helps you but me too.
Message from Germany to Turkey
Hi Jason, thanks for the press. A little surprised to hear that RT are not off to a full blown partnership.
The BLA bounce is a must in any scenario. Austria is a little weary of his neighbours to the point of paranoia.
Have you heared from him?
Italy says he hasnt which leads me to belive that either AR, FT or AT are off to a good start or Italy is lying about Austria. See how this fits in with your information. I can only pass on what i hear.
As we form no threat to each other we should keep each other informed of all minor details.
If you are not certain of the RT alliance then maybe italys comments mean something. An AT relation is a strange one indeed so draw your own conclusions. As stated I prefer an RT alliance right now. But maybe AR know something we dont. Keep in touch.
Message from Germany to Italy
I just received a message from Austria. He wanted a commitment of kie - den.
He also stated that I hadnt made any concrete suggestions. I thought I did with TYR and an IAG alliance for the spring moves. He is obviously talking to england as I have spoken openly with Russia regarding a bounce in sweden. Only england could therefor be directly concerned as to where my fleet is going, maybe france to a lesser extent to help along his talks with england. This can only lead me to the conclusion that FA are close. With a friendly FE and FA then you sound like a target for FA. Strange Austria hasnt spoken to you. Turkey mentioned that he is not sold on a full RT alliance just yet. This may point to an RA alliance or RT pretending not to get along. Just keep tieing all lose ends of information (and disinformation) together. Lets keep other in the picture.
Tony
Message from Germany to Russia
Hello again, well I have heared from everyone now. AT give the impression that they are friendly towards you so it looks like you will be attacking yourself. Austria is trying to fish out where me fleet is going, England and or France have no doubt asked for this information. Italy states that he hasnt heared from Austria.
Any news your end?
Message from Italy to Germany
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> Message from tvernon@chello.nl as Germany to Italy in 'c2':
>
> I just received a message from Austria. He wanted a commitment of kie - den.
> He also stated that I hadnt made any concrete suggestions. I thought I
did with TYR and an IAG alliance for the spring moves.
Those are fairly concrete suggestions.
He is obviously
talking to england as I have spoken openly with Russia regarding a
bounce in sweden. Only england could therefor be directly concerned as
to where my fleet is going, maybe france to a lesser extent to help
along his talks with england. This can only lead me to the conclusion
that FA are close. With a friendly FE and FA then you sound like a
target for FA.
Or he has a concern with Russia and wants to make sure if he is giving him
RUM that he wont be getting SWE as wll.
Strange Austria hasnt spoken to you.
I think so too.
Turkey mentioned
that he is not sold on a full RT alliance just yet. This may point to an
RA alliance or RT pretending not to get along. Just keep tieing all lose
ends of information (and disinformation) together. Lets keep other in
the picture.
Absolutely
take care
Andy
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> > To AIG, a toast.....may our cooporation blossom. Together we form a
> strong centre with enough expansion possibilities without antagonising
> each other. Our backs are covered. Let us erect a shrine in TYR and may
> it never come crumbling down.
> >
>
> An excellent sentiment. I agree whole-heartedly.
>
>
Then the construction of that shrine shall be initiated immediately
as I also agree. May no army ever violate the sanctity of that
sacred place!
Message from Austria to Germany
> I thought that we would make our rounds and then get back to each other with more concrete measures.
Of course, but the Galician question was presented to me
and I wanted to see if it was possible to go with the dmz
instead of the bounce. This way, I at least get some early
impression of how much I can trust Russia.
> I am still in the middle of talks, even to the point where I am asking AR to work with you.
> For now Russia and I are coming to terms regarding yours and his interacting in my eyes and my first impressions following a round
of talks. As you know I have suggested to you and Italy that we work together.
> A normal opening for germany would be to den, kie and BUR or RUH depending on negotiations and gut feelings.
> If I feel all is going well with england then KIE to DEN will be the move to make. I wish things to go well with both E and F. All
Russia has asked is that I dont bounce him in Sweden, I did point out to him that this has been suggested as a course of action if
certain situations arise. We spoke openly about it. I did state that I would like to see TYR empty, this not only helps you but me
too.
In the past, I have seen german players go for the three
builds with Ruh, Hol & Kie and knowing this possibility
exist make me nervous as Austria. It's a big gamble that
can be profitable for Germany, but wich leave Austria
vulnerable to a quick departure.
Anyway, I have gone with the dmz and mentioned the
question of the bounce of Sweden to Russia; but please
keep me appraise of the destination of your fleet so I
get the chance to change my mind if I'm getting bad vibe.
Good luck with England! I wouldn't mind dealing with
a Russia who doesn't have it too easy.
Philippe
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
> Hello Ben *timestamp* sent at 10:10 a.m.
Let's synchronize our watches.
> So how are negotiations going? I have spoken to all my
> neighbours now. I just have Turkey left.
> Italy mentioned that he had spoken to you and directly asked
> me if GI had plans from the gate.
Yeah, I figured. You two being the most senior veterans, I believe.
> I can only assume that he was referring to your intention on
> moving on BEL. Maybe he sees this as a possible E against F
> which he maybe would like to combine with a GI against France.
Interesting. But you don't want to do this?
> I informed him that I was still making my rounds. I got the
> impression that AI are friendly as ar RT. I have yet to speak
> to Turkey so I cant confirm this. The French asked me to
> discuss Belgium with him. This was before he knew that you
> had an eye on Belgium. A french interest for Belgium is
> usually used as a springboard for a convoy to england or an
> eventual attack on Gemany. How are negotiations going on the
> ENG channel?
We still have a few days. So far we haven't decided anything.
> It may also mean that he just wants to know my intention with
> Belgium. Usually a german invasion of Belgium spells trouble
> for France or s solid front line between the two nations to
> allow the other to look elsewhere.
> Taking the Italians comments into account an EG friendship
> seems the most likely. I guess you will have to wait and see
> how the Russian opens. If he is friendly with Turkey then I
> can only assume that Austria is the intended target. This
> gives you and I room to manouvre in the north. Lets see how
> it goes. I dont mind you getting BEL but I would obviously
> only like to see a fleet there. Maybe an opening edi - nwg,
> lon - nth, lvp - edi would leave all options open for you.
> But I would only allow a fleet into Belgium.
Depending on how negotiations go over the Channel, I definitely think we can
do something like that.
Ok I don't care anymore what time it is, right of England. ;-)
Ben
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> > That is a good way to do it, but fairly counter-productive if we are going
> > to work on a central powers alliance.
>
> With Rom-Ven, we only lose one move and my fleet is
> free to go to Alb in the fall, no big delay here.
Its the difference between building 1 and 2 in W01', that sounds fairly
major to me.
> > Assuming we are going with the Central powers ...its unneccesary.
>
> It is, if everyone is on the same page; but if you aren't
> there yet, expecting you to ask for more time while you
> contemplate invading my country wouldn't be very
> realistic to say the least.
I am completely with the idea, but limiting my moves *just because* doesnt
sit very well with me.
You have two other fronts to deal with, why do you want to be so paranoid
on my front.
> > Would you be willing to do a Key. The Turk is very inexperienced and would
> > likely work like a charm.
>
> The Key Lepanto is something I really got to try some
> day, as Italy; but I have yet to find an Austria willing to
> go for it. Also, this being a press game with lots of time
> to review options and drop hints to other players, I
> would expect someone to point him to the right article
> soon enough. FTF really seem to be the place to try
> this kind of tactic.
Ive done it successfully as both powers both online and ftf.
> Now, I don't want to give you the impression of being
> inflexible, but Tri-Ven isn't something I'm willing to
> negociate because survival is my first priority at the
> start of the game as Austria. I won't have as strong a
> start as I could have by taking more risk, but that's ok.
Well...you are strongly re-enforcing the impression that you do not
wish to.
You are holding 2 of my units hostage and saying ...you will do this MY
way....and that is not the way to have an healthy relationship.
Andy
Message from Italy to Germany
Tony.....
Philippe is being less than cooperative or helpful here.
Its a flaming baton
Thats ready to twirl
Its George Bush on acid
Singing the Duke of Earl
Gonna be a new world
-Mojo Nixon
Message from Russia to Germany
Got your messages.
I strongly appreciate your offer of support should Austria head to Gal
after declaring it a DMZ.
Indeed I did get a friendly message from Austria not too long after I got
yours. He's asked for a DMZ in Gal as you have suggested he would, so I'm
likely to agree. While the northern opening idea is intriguing, a Gal DMZ
leaves me open to potential nastiness, so I'm a bit loathe to send my
forces north until I see that the DMZs in Gal, Pru and Sil are being
honored. Speaking of which, you never agreed to my proposed DMZ in Pru/Sil,
nor did you say what your intentions were in Swe at this point.
At this point I am more likely to consider building in the north if things
go well in the south than making a strict northern opening and trusting
that everything in the south and west is going to go well. But I will keep
you up to date as the situation evolves.
--- Tzarface
Message from Germany to England
Hi Ben, just got your message.
Not much has changed here. Austria was pushing for news on my KIE fleet, I
spoke to Turkey last night whilst writing to you. He didnt confirm nor deny
any understanding between himself and Russia.
Although the actual spring moves take place do apparent alliances begin to
shine through, even then mainly due to the rolling of the dice. Concrete
plans cut this chance outcome down a little unless one of the parties is
surprised by a third party. How about some concrete plans. It will probably
be EGF trusting each other, EF against Germany, FG against England, EG
against France. Italy or Russia may say the balance with their respective
spring moves.
Have you a preference, north? south? towards me? in liasion with France and
me? with me? or shall we just await the spring outcome?
Let me know, chose wisely ;-)
Message from Germany to Germany
England didnt deny speaking to Italy or just read past it without it
registering. This could indicate a superficial contact between the two of us
or that he has had contact with Italy. I want to push him a little more.
I dropped the English/Italian contact im my message to France, as far as I
knew at that time the pair hadnt talked. The game had just started.
Anything to ensure that France doesnt want war from the outset helps me out.
I wish to plant a seed of doubt in his mind concerning an EI alliance. If
France and England had spoken shortly after my message to France then
England would not refer to any contact with Italy. It will be interesting
to see what France comes back with.
As for trying to push Russia north the same applies here. I would obviously
like to see Russia put pressure on England.
The same goes for Italy, if he is willing then by all means let him push for
PIE.
I have no concrete plans as yet. The Austrian pushing for information on my
fleet is interesting. The Italian analysis (mainly of scenario's I
deliberately left out) didnt reveal any new information.
Hopefully the press will flow freely and someone will let slip some
information on their or their allied alliance.
I will continue to pound all players with information, rubbish, rumors etc.
etc.
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
I missed part of the conversation or am having trouble diluting who said
what.
Experience tells me that AI are made for each other.
The two of you state that you are on the same page as I am when it comes to
a central alliance.
What moves have been suggested?
The Turk has mentioned the KEY to me, he is aware of it. He also said that
he and Russia are not yet fully alligned.
I suggest Austria sort out a DMZ in GAL and offter an offensive against
Turkey to Russia. I am pushing the Russian for a northern opening. He wont
be able to go for GAL and a northern opening. He started off stating an
offensive in the south. This is bad news for me and Austria. By south he
could mean RT or RA. If its RA then no problem there for Austria.
If we combine it all then its also in Austria interest to have the Russian
open to the north. The DMZ in GAL plays an important part. WAR - UKR in an
RA alliance allows the GIA to get off to a good start. I can concentrate
west with Italy and the pair of you can concentrate east. It also opens up
the possibility of AG moving North East when the time arrives to do so.
I certainly dont see Italy invading Austria, this usually ends in dissatser
for Italy and Austria usually does a U-turn and ensures that both powers are
removed. Let me know if I can be of any help in move negotiations. From the
press I just received I cant make out what was said before it regarding
moves.
If neither of you have concrete plans with any other neighbour then now is
the time to work on an AI plan based on trust.
OK, its diplomacy but dont let paranoia set in in the spring of 1901. If all
goes foul use revenge and get even. The surrounding neighbours will be more
than willing to pounce. Lets set the GIA foundation in solid cement from the
word go. The sping of 1901 is usually a dice game anyway. All of us will be
tempted by all offers made but if we stick to sorting this out during the
coming days then I am sure we will succeed.
Message from Germany to Italy
> Philippe is being less than cooperative or helpful here.>
Its something we have to work on. At least we are trying to iron out the
differences. If we keep talking then the trust will slowly come. I have
mailed you both in an attempt to get us off the mark. Lets see how it
develops. Once we see a press from Austria to the three of us then we know
we are getting somewhere.
No news elsewhere as yet, England came back with nothing. I havent heared
from France, gut feeling at this moment is EF. But there again maybe France
hasnt come to any agreement with England yet. I prefer to focus on a
possibility. As long as GIA work on the central alliance it is worthwhile.
If he doesnt change his attitude towards the alliance then we have to look
elsewhere. Any interesting developments?
Message from Germany to Germany
OK, I sent my first evaluation and reasoning before I read the IA press. No
clear picture yet as to possible alliances so I will continue to push AI for
the central alliance.
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
I think you and I see S'01 pretty much the same way. Keep options open & do
not be the victim of an ugly surprise.
France mentioned the Western Triple to me - did he ask you too? If so what
do you think?
You make a good case for EG in your last note but I really haven't decided &
not likely to commit until I see what our various neighbors are up to. How
are I/F relations? Can you tell?
As to my own preference - I haven't really got one. I have never played
England in a press game before & am trying to feel my way through - any
words of wisdom ("Never attack Germany. Always attack France. Give your
dots to Germany. And give your dots to Germany.") you have would be
appreciated.
Ben
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
(Just read Tony's reply as I was ready to send this. Seem my
style of play for Austria, is too conservative but will it be that
much of a problem? I assure you that my paranoia is very
limited and I'm not about to spend the rest of the game sitting
over my homeland to protect all my precious sc ;-) I would
normally agree with the revenge argument, but I don't think
Austria really has the time to get his revenge if he's stab right
away.)
Andy (with copy to Tony),
Maybe I'm being paranoid, but it's not limited to your front.
I have also asked Tony about bouncing Russia in Sweden if
he try to enter Galicia. I assure you that it has nothing to do
with you or anyone else. Without some tactical play, I don't
think Austria can ever prevent his quick elimination. You
may have all the right feeling and be sure of your diplomacy,
but a concerted attack by Italy & Russia will show you the
door before you can do anything about it, the perfect stab.
I may be wrong and will learn to change my mind about this
in time; but for the moment, this is how I feel. Of course, this
limit my diplomacy and prevent me from being as flexible as
you might want; but this is a short term occurence that does
not limit you that much.
The sending of my fleet to Venice doesn't preclude you from
attacking France or Turkey. A move to Pie is rarely followed
by a second when the first one succeed and it's not possible
to convoy two armies in 1901 with only one fleet. Whatever
is done, one italian armies always remain around Venice at the
end of 1901, unless it is roaming in Austria with or without
his permission.
My hope is that you will accept to open with a Lepanto, but
I don't expect you to do so simply because I'm suggesting it.
If an invasion of France is more appealing to you then moving
against Turkey, then I will have to see how I can change that
and it will be my loss if I can't.
Philippe.
P.-S. Regarding the lost of one build, I would point out that
with Turkey as a target, there ain't much place to move to for
armies going south and a delay of one move would still allow
my fleet to be in position to support Ion-Aeg from Greece in
the fall.
Message from Germany to Russia
Hi Tzarface.
Austria is a little paranoid but by the sound of it the DMZ has his thumbs
up.
The reason I never mentioned SIL/PRU is because that would be the least of
my problems. I wanted to get the message of RA over first. We have plenty
of time. I have never opened to SIL/BOH as Germany nor have I ever seen
WAR - BOH. It goes without saying that I have no problems with SIL/PRU and
just for the record would like to add BOH.
In the initial stages me attacking you would be suicide with FEAI all around
me waiting to move on any weak power. I would just be strecthing my forces
and allowing England/France to grab the lowlands and scandinavia.
We did speak of Sweden. I would have no reason to prevent your build unless
you were hostile towards me in the spring. Something I know wont happen. So
yes, sweden is yours. I recall stating that I even want Sweden to carry on
to Norway. Lets take it one step at the time. I dont mind sending an RA
message about GAL and will do so immediately.
Lets keep talking. Nothing new yet from England or France or Turkey, or
Italy or Austria.
Tony
Message from Germany to Austria, Italy, and Russia
Hi guys, seperately we speak of having interest in a DMZ in GAL, TYR, SIL,
BOH, PRU. I feel we need reassuring that this is the case. As we are working
on plans for all 4 of us then maybe all of us should agree that if one of us
doesnt stick to a DMZ (GAL/SIL/PRU/BOH/TYR) then the remaining powers will
come to each others aid.
Its war and there are seven powers, we need to start hammering out a code of
conduct to ensure future colaboration.
We need to knock the number of powers down asap and ensure we have a broad
alliance to do so. So far GIA have been trying to coordinate plans. So has
Austria and Russia and Germany and Russia. With Russia on board then we can
at least build on a 4 some to start off with.
This leaves EFT as the targets. Something which should suit all of us as
they are in remote corners in relation to the 4 of us. With 3 of us pounding
Turkey, two of us pounding England, and two of us pounding France then we
run little risk.
A well coordinated 4 way alliance right now would minimize our risks. To
further enforce our strategy Russia and Germany need to make concrete plans
in the north. As does Germany Italy in the west. The three of you can easily
coordinate against biddy widdy Turkey in the corner.
Even the intention to work together and sticking to open communication is a
big step forward. Overcome paranoia and lets get this spring 1901 move off
to a good start for the 4 of us. Let me know guys. Press all 4 of us. The
more we talk openly the mopre we coordinate and can help each other overcome
initial reservations.
Tony
Message from Germany to England
> Tony - > I think you and I see S'01 pretty much the same way. Keep
options open & do
not be the victim of an ugly surprise.>
I agree completely. Usually EFG have one hell of a fight and someone in the
east grows like cauliflower.
> France mentioned the Western Triple to me - did he ask you too? If so
what
> do you think?>
I mentioned it to the both of you, first to you then to him when I sent him
a copy of my p.s. from my first mail to you(There is room for the 3 of us)
remember.
> You make a good case for EG in your last note but I really haven't decided
&
> not likely to commit until I see what our various neighbors are up to.
How
> are I/F relations? Can you tell?
Yes, my attitude too, lets see what they do. Everyone promises everything in
the spring. By fall we should have some basis on which to build once the
initial nerves have settled down.
Neither has mentioned anything. Italy did say he spoke to France but he
didnt go into details. I havent heared from France since his and mine
opening messages, followed with a message from me to him. But by the look of
things he has let my message sinke in and talked to you about it. I assume
he will be contacing me shortly. Maybe you or him should set up a 3 way
press. I dont mind initiating it. Let me know.
> As to my own preference - I haven't really got one. I have never played
> England in a press game before & am trying to feel my way through - any
> words of wisdom ("Never attack Germany. Always attack France. Give your
> dots to Germany. And give your dots to Germany.") you have would be
> appreciated.
I always find England nerve racking in the first year, even after that its
difficult to develop. You need fleets, loads of them with the occasional
army thrown in at the right time. Once France or England gets the initial
stab in then its difficult to retaliate. The one who moves first usually
comes out the best. But its diplomacy and anything can happen.
The more solid the base the better for those in that base. An EFG fanning
outwards may ensure the comforting feeling we all need right now. But once
again its diplomacy. No matter what happens keep diploming. Use all styles.
Sometimes its just luck the first spring. But just look at it as real life
diplomacy with real countries ran by real people and all emotions and
feelings related to such an environment.
The sooner you build up a relationship the better. The bigger the
relationship in diplomacy the better. The stab when it comes is best dealt
out when its least expected but does has a devestating result.
But do remember, everyone has the right to your opinion ;-)
Let the board dictate your style of diplomacy at all time. Even if someone
has stabbed you a hundred fold there will always be a time when he needs
you. Stay in control of your own destiny for as long as possible but grab
what power you can especially if you can hold onto it. I will let you know
when I hear from France, as it is I have sent him two presses so I have to
await his reply. If you wish get a 3 way press going.
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> What moves have been suggested?
>
Philippe is insisting on moving TRI - VEN in S01'
This leaves me in a spot.
It pins down one or both of my armies for the entire first year of the
game.
He is also insisting that I Lepanto.....and using the logic that a Key
would be leaked to the Turk regardless.....
If your concern is that the Key will be leaked, the other powers will see
a Lepanto on the horizon and make plans to defend it.
There are meta-gaming issues with attacking France.
I am going to leave Venice in place for the whole year, that way I can
actually do something with my other army, or I can just attack Trieste in
defense and turn this into a much bigger mess than it needs to be.
Or maybe I am over-reacting....or maybe I just dont like to be told what
to do......or maybe I dont like to be told that my *ally* is attacking me
and its defensive and for my own good.
We are either allies or we arent, and if we are, then there is ABSOLUTELY
ZERO reason for the move, and if we arent then I just want to know ahead
of time.
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
I am going to save your press. Thank you for sharing so much.
Now, we wait.
Ben
Message from Italy to Germany
> > Philippe is being less than cooperative or helpful here.>
>
> Its something we have to work on. At least we are trying to iron out the
> differences. If we keep talking then the trust will slowly come. I have
> mailed you both in an attempt to get us off the mark. Lets see how it
> develops. Once we see a press from Austria to the three of us then we know
> we are getting somewhere.
I spelled out why I was annoyed, and was probably over-reacting but
if this is going to work, I need him to know how I feel.
> No news elsewhere as yet, England came back with nothing. I havent heared
> from France, gut feeling at this moment is EF. But there again maybe France
> hasnt come to any agreement with England yet. I prefer to focus on a
> possibility. As long as GIA work on the central alliance it is worthwhile.
I havent heard much from either of them.
> If he doesnt change his attitude towards the alliance then we have to look
> elsewhere. Any interesting developments?
France isnt talking, but that isnt a surprise.
Turkey is damn quiet
I will be much softer in my next press to the two of you.
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
Remember that GIA are the heart of the central alliance. Russia joining is
is purely cosmetic but does aid our cause.
If he remianed part of the central alliance then Austria would have nowhere
to go once Turkey falls.
We just need Russia to stick with Austria for the first year. He will no
doubt spot the flaw in the 4 way but we can rest assure him that there is
growth in scandinavia and england. We will just be expanding the central
powers borders when the time arrives.
Philippe, I understand your feeling but if Austria is ment to fall then it
will be at the hands of RIT. They usually slice you up. An italian push into
Austria (ven - tri, rom - ven) leaves plenty of space for retaliation. You
would still have 3 units if you bounce yourseff in GAL (vie & bud) to GAL
and move TRI - ALB. This leaves you 3 against his two. Russia would pick up
any advantage and Italy would be left without a build if he had to use ION
to cut support from ALB.
Its just to messy even with Russias help. I dont want to get into scenarios.
I am looking for a common trust amongst two or three powers (prefably 4) to
ensure a quick start. You havent expressed fears towards me and I would push
for TYR if Italy attacks you.
If you invite him in then thats another matter of course.
Moves wise we can always work out any deep concerns. If worst comes to the
worst just have ven hold and move nap - ion and rom - apu. I would attack
any austrian unit in TYR, I dont mind VEN not moving on PIE if it sorts out
the AI situation. My main aim is the basis for cooporation and the central
power alliance. If we have to wait till fall then so be it.
Lets see how the GAIR develops as well. Maybe more communication will ease
initial concerns.
Message from France to Germany
>
> Well I have spoken to all my neighbours now, only Turkey left.
Yes, everyone seems present and accounted for, which is a good sign.
Nothing worse than a game with people missing from the start.
> So far I have concluded that the Englishman will want Belgium. To do
> this he may go for the ENG and NTH. I have informed it that if anything
> only a fleet of his would be welcome.
England usually wants Belgium, so this isn't much of a surprise, but I
appreciate the information. I can tell you from my plan that he's been
fairly aggressive about making deals with me, though he's not too strong
with specific tactical suggestions. I get the feeling that he'd really
like to get an army on the continent. I have also informed him that I'd
prefer to see a fleet in Bel.
I think his concern over taking Belgium is a possible sign that he's
headed south -- he and Russia are both rather talkative, so there's no
telling what's gone on between them. I'm largely guessing, but I think
they've done some early planning, and while that's not good for either of
us, it's particularly bad for you. I know you think Russia's opening
North; maybe my interpretation of the situation is wrong. Maybe I'm just
paraoid ;).
In any case, I'm agreed: it's better to keep English armies out of
Belgium. Obviously, I'd rather not see him go to Eng, but at least I can
prepare for it.
> RA also seem reasonably friendly judging by the seperate press I
> received and after putting two and two together. This leads me to
> believe that Russia may open to the north. This may leave open up an
> opportunity for you and me in the west. AI will no doubt go after Turkey
> unless Italy has been convinced that GIT against France is a reasonable
> alternative for his VEN army if he is frinedly with Austria.
>
So you think RAI against Turkey, eh? Sometimes that's not the best for
France -- Italy usually gets bored and heads west. I will have to keep an
eye on him. Any heads up you can give me about his movements would be
appreciated.
Italy also seems to be very wary of you -- just thought I'd let you know.
I don't know if you've played against him before, but I get the feeling
that he sees you as a serious long-term threat. Maybe I'm wrong. And
doesn't a friendly RAI mean problems for you down the road, too?
I like your opening plans. I need to study the map a little more, but I
can tell you that the opening you talked about worked out for me last
game. If you're proposing keeping England out of Belgium, where would you
like to head after we succeed in keeping him contained?
Erik
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> Maybe I'm being paranoid, but it's not limited to your front.
> I have also asked Tony about bouncing Russia in Sweden if
> he try to enter Galicia. I assure you that it has nothing to do
> with you or anyone else. Without some tactical play, I don't
> think Austria can ever prevent his quick elimination. You
> may have all the right feeling and be sure of your diplomacy,
> but a concerted attack by Italy & Russia will show you the
> door before you can do anything about it, the perfect stab.
You usually have to have 3 on board to eliminate Austria in the way you
describe.
>
> I may be wrong and will learn to change my mind about this
> in time; but for the moment, this is how I feel. Of course, this
> limit my diplomacy and prevent me from being as flexible as
> you might want; but this is a short term occurence that does
> not limit you that much.
I disagree....but will work with you on it.
> The sending of my fleet to Venice doesn't preclude you from
> attacking France or Turkey.
How so?
If I want to move to Piedmont, I cant, without leaving my armies in Rome
and Piedmont.
A move to Pie is rarely followed
> by a second when the first one succeed and it's not possible
> to convoy two armies in 1901 with only one fleet. Whatever
> is done, one italian armies always remain around Venice at the
> end of 1901, unless it is roaming in Austria with or without
> his permission.
No....I could be in an Alpine Chicken.
> My hope is that you will accept to open with a Lepanto, but
> I don't expect you to do so simply because I'm suggesting it.
> If an invasion of France is more appealing to you then moving
> against Turkey, then I will have to see how I can change that
> and it will be my loss if I can't.
I will do the lepanto....I dont particurally like it, but I will do it.
Message from Germany to England
> I am going to save your press. Thank you for sharing so much.>
I always lie ;-)
That was a lie ;-)
Either way the main lesson I have learnt is stay in control of your own
destiny, if you lose it sit back and strike when you can retake possession
of that destiny again . Try not to lose it again ;-)
Look at the whole board!
> Now, we wait.>
No, yes, maybe..... we still need to at least try and get the EFG working.
Maybe you should both pay me a visit to discuss matter further ;-) just
leave me BER to cotemplate on retaliation ;-)
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> Remember that GIA are the heart of the central alliance. Russia joining is
> is purely cosmetic but does aid our cause.
Correct.
> If he remianed part of the central alliance then Austria would have nowhere
> to go once Turkey falls.
Correct.
> We just need Russia to stick with Austria for the first year. He will no
> doubt spot the flaw in the 4 way but we can rest assure him that there is
> growth in scandinavia and england. We will just be expanding the central
> powers borders when the time arrives.
That works.
> Philippe, I understand your feeling but if Austria is ment to fall then it
> will be at the hands of RIT. They usually slice you up. An italian push into
> Austria (ven - tri, rom - ven) leaves plenty of space for retaliation.
Its really easy to kick me out....and we both die.
You
> would still have 3 units if you bounce yourseff in GAL (vie & bud) to GAL
> and move TRI - ALB. This leaves you 3 against his two. Russia would pick up
> any advantage and Italy would be left without a build if he had to use ION
> to cut support from ALB.
Well....it you are going to relagate yourself to one build anyway....do
the full hedgehog....
Tri - Ven
Vie and Bud bounce in Galacia, you still get Serbia in the fall
Message from Germany to France
Hi Erik, good to hear from you.
>I get the feeling that he'd really like to get an army on the continent.>
I have made it clear to him that I would not accept an army in Belgium.
>Maybe I'm just paraoid ;).>
I think we all are.
>Italy usually gets bored and heads west. I will have to keep an
eye on him. Any heads up you can give me about his movements would be
appreciated.> I will answer to this in a moment.
>GIT against France is a reasonable alternative for his VEN army if he is
friendly with Austria.>
I ment to say GIE against France, not GIT against france.
By this I ment that unless England mentioned he had spoken to Italy to you
then he kept it secret. If I tie this to your statement about england moving
south because he seems friendly with Russia then keeping his talks with
Italy secret
fits in. Speaking of paranoia ;-)
On the other hand he may be cooperating with england and move VEN - TYR to
help solve englands need for Belgium.
>Italy usually gets bored and heads west. I will have to keep an
eye on him. Any heads up you can give me about his movements would be
appreciated.>
I will come to that after your next line of text.
>Italy also seems to be very wary of you -- just thought I'd let you know.
I don't know if you've played against him before, but I get the feeling
that he sees you as a serious long-term threat. Maybe I'm wrong. And
doesn't a friendly RAI mean problems for you down the road, too?>
Now for answers to both the above. Italy is I believe still trying to sort
out an agreement with Austria.
I havent played against him before, I guess we are all long term threats to
each other.
Yes a friendly RAI would spell trouble for me at some time or another as it
would to England and you.
That brings me back to my initial EFG comments I made during day 1.
I get the feeling though that England will sit out the spring and see what
happens.
You too can afford to do so as can I.
>>I like your opening plans. I need to study the map a little more, but I
can tell you that the opening you talked about worked out for me last
game. If you're proposing keeping England out of Belgium, where would you
like to head after we succeed in keeping him contained?>>
To england ofcourse. First clean up our backyard. If we cant get him onboard
then we should ensure that Russia doesnt get him onboard first. With an army
each in the UK we could take EDI and LVP and use LON as a share SC given to
the one who needs it most at the time. But no more that an army each in the
UK.
We help each other around PIE/TYR. If the situation allows it then you
passing through MUN is also a possibility.
Its hard to hold anyway. We could swap LON for MUN when the ocassion calls
for it and swap back once you leave MUN.
I have more growth potential than you unless I let you pass through MUN at
some time or another.
Especially if we have a strong Italy.
Just thoughts on a long term strategy. But first we have to sort out the
EFG. Do we sit back in the spring and await what happens or do we all 3 join
forces now. I dont think he will come on board. He wont commit until next
year.
Or shall me and you come out all guns blazing and make his mind up for him?
Let me know.
Turkey is the quiet one, he hasnt said much as far as I know.
Message from Germany to England and France
Well France just sent me a press. Either all three of us sit back and wait
or we start an EFG press going to kill time and see what develops. Any
preference? or will you two be paying me a visit ;-)
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
(I just read the follow up on this crisis and I wish to thank
Andy for agreeing to the Lepanto, but I don't want him to
feel compel to. I assure you that I'm willing to discuss the
problem created by Tri-Ven and see what can be done
about it. As for the Alpine Chicken being a possibility that
is blocked by Tri-Ven, I agree; but having used it to hide
an attack on Austria in the past, I won't pretend to be sorry
to see it blocked.)
The only thing I'm insisting on is Tri-Ven and it is a defensive
move done for my own peace of mind with no accusation of
any actual intent on Andy's part. If you think this is an attack,
explain to me what it is achieving offensive wise?
Philippe
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
> No, yes, maybe..... we still need to at least try and get the
> EFG working.
> Maybe you should both pay me a visit to discuss matter
> further ;-) just
> leave me BER to cotemplate on retaliation ;-)
:-)
Seriously, about an EFG. First of all I had read that it is Germany who
takes the risk. Second, I do not think it will affect my S'01, except I
guess would resolve the Channel, but my opening would remain the standard
one you suggested before. So I don't know how much it affects me.
Are you prepared to order BER - SIL? Or do you have something else in mind?
> Well France just sent me a press. Either all three of us sit back and wait
> or we start an EFG press going to kill time and see what develops. Any
> preference? or will you two be paying me a visit ;-)
Sorry - I was waiting for you to open up the three-way discussion.
Ben
Message from England to France and Germany
Oops! Didn't realize this was sent to France too. I'll send it again:
******
Seriously, about an EFG. First of all I had read that it is Germany who
takes the risk. Second, I do not think it will affect my S'01, except I
guess would resolve the Channel, but my opening would remain the standard
one you suggested before. So I don't know how much it affects me.
Are you prepared to order BER - SIL? Or do you have something else in mind?
> Well France just sent me a press. Either all three of us sit back and wait
> or we start an EFG press going to kill time and see what develops. Any
> preference? or will you two be paying me a visit ;-)
Sorry - I was waiting for you to open up the three-way discussion.
Ben
******
Message from Germany to England
>Sorry - I was waiting for you to open up the three-way discussion.>
I think I did, but press seems to be crossing each other.
>>First of all I had read that it is Germany who
takes the risk. Second, I do not think it will affect my S'01, except I
guess would resolve the Channel, but my opening would remain the standard
one you suggested before. So I don't know how much it affects me.>
He who dares wins ;-)
Well if either EF, EG, FG team up against the one the that one is in trouble
unless a third party intervenes.
Your standard opening is OK unless France moves on the ENG. Russia may open
to bounce you in Norway. You then have to chose between LON and NWY. A worst
case scenario. Usually a bounce in the ENG is the safest bet when in doubt.
<BER - SIL>
This would only be interesting if the EFG was a clear cut fact. We have a
long way to go before it is. If it was then a move to SIL and BOH would be
better. But if I get it wrong then I will be doomned to be an observer in
the game.
We would have to discuss the EFG a lot more before I would make such a move.
Your opening dont forget stll leaves A YOR - BEL a possibility. One I would
have to take into account.
Message from Germany to England and France
> Oops! Didn't realize this was sent to France too. I'll send it again:
>
> ******>
It wasnt was it? anyway it is now. But nothing secret as can be seen
Unless you ment to say "Didnt realize this wasn't sent to France too".
> Seriously, about an EFG. First of all I had read that it is Germany who
> takes the risk. Second, I do not think it will affect my S'01, except I
> guess would resolve the Channel, but my opening would remain the standard
> one you suggested before. So I don't know how much it affects me.
>
> Are you prepared to order BER - SIL? Or do you have something else in
mind?
>
> > Well France just sent me a press. Either all three of us sit back and
wait
> > or we start an EFG press going to kill time and see what develops. Any
> > preference? or will you two be paying me a visit ;-)
> Sorry - I was waiting for you to open up the three-way discussion.
>
> Ben
> ******
>
Well as stated in my reply. I would have to be very sure of an EFG to order
that move.
Lets start talking. Get the press going. I havent eaten yet so you two talk
and count me in the press. I will reply later this evening.
Message from Germany to Russia
An EFG press is being initiated. I will let you know the outcome. So far
England has only indicated a sit back wait and see attitude. I will keep you
abreast of developments.
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
I am trying to read between the lines & I'm getting the sense you are
looking for comfort from France, which is perfectly understandable.
> We would have to discuss the EFG a lot more before I would
> make such a move.
"We" who?
> Your opening dont forget stll leaves A YOR - BEL a
> possibility. One I would have to take into account.
I don't understand. You don't want this, do you?
Ok, I'll be away from my computer for awhile. I admit I cannot keep up with
your level of correspondence - I am pleased to have a slow day today at work
to get things off on the right foot. :-)
Ben
Message from Germany to England
We as in EFG would have to discuss it further.
No, I definitely dont want an army in BEL. But your opening does allow for
just that. I was just pointing out the fact.
Yes, I need some assurance from France. He said you are hard in
negotiations, I havent noticed that. I understood your message where you
stated lets wait and see. Lets wait indeed. Maybe France will continue the
EFG press. If not then we will just have to wait and see. But we can still
discuss matters without him.
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
OK, we seem to be getting somewhere. If TRI - VEN is a definite then at
least it holds no surprises.
Can we work from here?
rom - ven, tri - ven bounce
nap - ion or tys (convoy nap to tun)
ven - pie
or
ven hold
rom - apu
nap - ion
Any move will do as long as you two are in agreement. Its not the basis for
a trustworthy start but Italy cant ignore the tri - ven move.
Are we going to continue down this avenue or are all bets off between ai?
Message from Germany to Turkey
Just gonna ride out the storm hey and pick up the pieces ;-)
How are things down there.
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> Can we work from here?
yes...
>
> Any move will do as long as you two are in agreement. Its not the basis for
> a trustworthy start but Italy cant ignore the tri - ven move.
And since the Alpine Chicken is always the subterfuge to attack Austria
with, I wont do that either.
> Are we going to continue down this avenue or are all bets off between ai?
I am doing a plain, boring lepanto.
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> I am doing a plain, boring lepanto.
Do you mean:
Sprin -Rom-Ven (bounce), Ven-Apu & Nap-Ion
Fall -Rom-Ven (succeed), Apu-Ion-Tun & Ion c Apu-Tun
or
Spring -Ven hold or Ven-Tri, Rom-Apu & Nap-Ion
Fal l-Ven hold or Ven-Tri, Apu-ion-Tun & Ion c Apu-tun
I'm ok with both and will go with Andy's choice. With the
first, I'm free to send my fleet to Alb in the fall. With the
second, for what it's worth, we can simulate a conflict.
Philippe.
P.-S. Any news from Russia?
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
this isnt helping the whole *trust* thing at all.
>
> Spring -Ven hold or Ven-Tri, Rom-Apu & Nap-Ion
> Fal l-Ven hold or Ven-Tri, Apu-ion-Tun & Ion c Apu-tun
I will be holding unless I see something in Tyrolia.
>
> I'm ok with both and will go with Andy's choice. With the
> first, I'm free to send my fleet to Alb in the fall. With the
> second, for what it's worth, we can simulate a conflict.
And I reserve the right to just take Tunis with the fleet if I dont like
what I see.
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> I will be holding unless I see something in Tyrolia.
> And I reserve the right to just take Tunis with the fleet if I dont like
> what I see.
Understood. Suggesting we simulate a conflict might
not have been appropriate given the context, but I
was only spelling out options (if my fleet is sitting in
Trieste this fall, she's available to support Ven, hold
or repeat Tri-Ven, but I will simply hold). I assure
you I had no ulterior motive here and I apologize if
I gave you that impression.
Philippe
Message from France to England and Germany
>
> Well as stated in my reply. I would have to be very sure of an EFG to
> order
> that move.
> Lets start talking. Get the press going.
Couldn't agree more. If you're both amenable to a Western Triple, then I
think it's a good idea, too. Seems to me like RAI are getting pretty
friendly, and that's bad news for us -- after Turkey is dispatched, Italy
heads west, Russia heads north, and Austria bites into his German
neighbor. If we attack jointly early, we can take care of them while
they're still focusing on Turkey. With Italy being as cagey as he is
toward Germany and I, I think this is a very smart move.
So what are we each going to do specifically? I can open BRE - MAO, Mar -
SPA, Par - Bur, which is pretty standard western triple stuff. Or, we
could take this approach ...
http://devel.diplom.org/Zine/F1999R/Szykman/triple.html
Much more ambitious and with a better possible long-term reward, but it
only gets us one build each after the first year. Please take a look and
let me know what you think.
Erik
Message from Germany to England and France
I like the look of it. Its a lot better than your suggested PAR - BUR ;-)
I would be willing to give it a try, only my moves can be considered really
agressive along with mar - pie.
France and I need to be pretty certain that england will join in and follow
through.
Lets see what england thinks.
Message from England to France and Germany
Gentlemen -
I have out of town company & will get back to you probably Sunday. I see
you have a proposal(s) on the table & I wish I had time to look at it but I
don't - sorry.
Ben
Message from Turkey to Germany
Appreciate the reply.
I have heard from Austria, and he does seem a little twitchy, but then
again who isn't? :-)
France is telling me that AIR are going in together, so I'm not sure
exactly what to believe. Anything you can pass on about that would be
appreciated.
jason
Message from Germany to Russia
Didnt you receive my very very long press? I have a few details I wish to
pass on but I am still awaiting a reply from you.
Message from Germany to Turkey
Hi Jason, France has said many things. He continuously warns me that Italy
sees me as a big threat and doesnt trust me.
As for the AIR, this seems very unlikely. By now I would have thought that
you, Italy and Russia had already shared all Austrian SC's amongst you.
I did hear from Italy, he informed me that you were very quiet. How are
negotiations going with IR?
Tony
Message from England to France and Germany
> So what are we each going to do specifically? I can open BRE - MAO, Mar -
> SPA, Par - Bur, which is pretty standard western triple stuff. Or, we
> could take this approach ...
>
> http://devel.diplom.org/Zine/F1999R/Szykman/triple.html
>
> Much more ambitious and with a better possible long-term reward, but it
> only gets us one build each after the first year. Please take a look and
> let me know what you think.
This looks like a blast. I'm in.
Ben
p.s. I grabbed 30 seconds to look at the site & send this - if this is not
the proposal I should be looking at let me know.
Message from England to all
Gentlemen -
I have out of town company this weekend & will not likely be available
until about 36 hour from now. Which is roughly a day and a half, in Tony's
time.
Thank you for your patience.
Ben
Message from Turkey to Germany
Thanks for letting me know about Italy. We've talked some, but I'll make
sure to drop him another note.
Otherwise, negotiations seem to be going well. As I said before,
everyone's fairly friendly at the outset. Both I and R have similar
designs on the middle, but Austria is claiming to have made some sort of
breakthrough in talks to secure his future, but I have no idea what that
means.
How goes EFG?
jason
Message from Germany to Turkey
EFG is on hold. England is away. We all seem to mistrust each other. I guess
it will be just standard openings to await what happens.
Message from England to France and Germany
Gentlemen -
I have put my moves in with wait set, for the Western Triple opening we
discussed.
Are we all in?
Ben
Message from Germany to England and France
Count me in, I like the look of it. I like unusual openings. Its the only
decent proposal so far.
I run the most risk as I have to full frontal on Russia.
It will be interesting to see their faces in the fall. But I will want to
see frances approval
Message from England to all
Greetings one and all. Company's gone & the house is quiet, but tomorrow
will probably be pretty busy, so forgive me if response time lags.
Ben
Message from Russia to Germany
>Didnt you receive my very very long press? I have a few details I wish to
>pass on but I am still awaiting a reply from you.
Sorry, I have three messages from you. I started a response at work Friday,
but apparently I never finished and sent it. It was a very busy day at
work, and I was sending out messages for two games between meetings. I
thought I had sent something to you, but apparently didn't really.
Yesterday (and most of today) I was out of town and out of Internet reach.
So I have indeed been ignoring you, but not intentionally. As I said, I
thought I had sent press to you -- must have been that I sent press to
Germany in a different game. (Hopefully I didn't talk about our plans with
him though!)
I will admit that I was a little annoyed when you sent the RIA combined
press, because I am still talking with Austria about whether we want a DMZ
in Gal or a bounce. I didn't appreciate having my ability to negotiate such
an arrangement superceded by your broadcast. That said, when I went back
over my last press to you, I can see why you could have misinterpreted my
message that said "I might agree to the DMZ" to mean that I wanted you to
press the issue.
>We did speak of Sweden. I would have no reason to prevent your build unless
>you were hostile towards me in the spring. Something I know wont happen. So
>yes, sweden is yours. I recall stating that I even want Sweden to carry on
>to Norway. Lets take it one step at the time.
I'm very happy to cooperate with Sweden. As I said earlier, though, I'm
more likely to build north than to move north. So far, I agree that England
is playing wait and see. France and I are talking some, but nothing very
specific. What I've heard indicates that IA don't like each other. I assume
your broadcast was intended to help contain that situation. While in
concept I don't mind the idea of your four-way GRAI arrangement to allow us
to get the step on Turkey, I will admit that I'm concerned about putting
myself into a position where other people get to control who I get to work
with. Meaning, that if Austria attacks Italy I'd be duty-bound to attack
him, and vice-versa. That might be a problem if I'm in the middle of
something with Turkey.
>Lets keep talking. Nothing new yet from England or France or Turkey, or
>Italy or Austria.
Sounds good. Again, my apologies for the long silence. I thought I had been
sharing information, but my message to you got lost.
I'll get back to you on what develops between Austria and me. As I said, so
far we've agreed that we'll probably DMZ Gal, but we were still debating
bouncing there instead. If we bounce because we mutually agree to, I don't
want that to cause you to keep Sweden out of my hands!
--- Tzarface
Message from France to England and Germany
>
> Count me in, I like the look of it. I like unusual openings.
> Its the only decent proposal so far. I run the most risk as I
> have to full frontal on Russia. It will be interesting to see
> their faces in the fall. But I will want to see frances approval
Of course you have my approval -- I suggested it. I'm glad to know that
we all find this interesting and worthwhile. I think we could make some
lightning gains from it.
Okay, given that we're all on board, I think we need to review our
information about other powers to maximize our chances of success. I can
tell what little I know: Austria and Italy seem to be friendly, Italy is
wary of Germany, Turkey is probably the odd man out in the east but
doesn't realize it.
Can you guys share anything you've learned? Tony, what's your
relationship with Austria like? Any indication where he's opening?
Erik
Message from Germany to England and France
My picture is the same. AI friendly and Turkey the odd man out. Although I must admit I know very little about Russia.
Message from Germany to Russia
No you two bouncing wouldnt be a problem. They do seem to be having their difficulties as Austria insists on opening tri - ven. But at least he is open about it.
Message from Austria to Germany
Hi Tony,
Unless you heard something else from Andy, I think that while
tense because of my insistence on Tri-Ven, GIA is going to
work out. As for Russia, he seem to be going along with it, but
I will be more confortable once you confirm Kie-Den to me.
On your side, how are things going?
Philippe
Message from England to France and Germany
> My picture is the same. AI friendly and Turkey the odd man out.
> Although I must admit I know very little about Russia.
I can contribute that I expect a bounce in the Black Sea. For what it's
worth.
Ben
Message from Germany to Austria
I have spoken to Russia, he informed me that the pair of you were still working on the GAL situation (to bounce or not to bounce).
Apart from that I am still awaiting some communication to confirm the cooporation between all 4 of us else AIG go it alone and await Russia's spring moves.
I am still in negotiations with Russia, he ofcourse is insisting that I dont bounce him in Sweden. I said that I would not as long as I had no reason to do so. I also coupled the AR coming to agreemnt on GAL as part of this agreement. So if he does doubble cross you then you can count on me.
Message from Germany to England and France
I do now understand that AI are having a little disagreement on the spring moves concerning VEN.
Austria wants to move TRI - VEN no matter what. This is only good news for us as this limits Italys orders.
This also means that he cant move to PIE which fits our plan fine. But there again I couldnt see him moving there anyway. I have a DMZ agreement on TYR for what its worth in S1901M.
I also hear that Russia and Austria are fine tuning details on GAL. Maybe no bounce or agreed bounce.
If its no bounce then thats either bad news for Turkey or England. Either way it still doesnt interfere with our plan. My moves are in too with set wait.
Message from France to Germany
(note that England has been excluded from this press)
Tony:
> Austria wants to move TRI - VEN no matter what. This is only good news
> for us as this limits Italys orders.
How do you know this? Austria's been exceptionally vague in his messages
to me, so I'm surprised he would be so blunt with you. You must have had
better luck cultivating a relationship with him. In any case, it's good to
know. Andy has been adamant in his claims that he's not interested in
attacking me, so knowing that there's going to be some Austrian pressure
definitely helps.
> I also hear that Russia and Austria are fine tuning details on GAL.
> Maybe no bounce or agreed bounce.
As far as I know, Russia's playing a conservative opening, but doesn't
suspect an attack from you. I didn't know about the bounce. You may not
take Warsaw in '01, but the bounce in Sweden and the fall '01 move to
Livonia and Prussia should guarantee you the center in '02.
> If its no bounce then thats either bad news for Turkey or England.
> Either way it still doesnt interfere with our plan. My moves are in too
> with set wait.
>
Excellent, mine too. I'll send out a confirmation e-mail of what our moves
should be to both you and England in a second, but I wanted to chat with
you first about where to head after '02. England is typically the prime
beneficiary of a Western Triple, given his ability to stab while you're
fighting Russia and I'm off in the Mediterranean. I'm hoping this
variation will lessen that advantage to some degree. We need to be
prepared to switch direction after '02 and take him on. Any idea how you
can justify a fleet build in Kiel when we start reaping the benefits from
the triple attack? I'm not sure that a lone fleet in Brest will be enough
to handle an England with a fleet in London and Nth and another fleet up
north somewhere.
Erik
Message from Germany to France
Erik, well I have been thinking about it too. His opening compared to mine
and yours is fairly standard.
You on the otherhand move on Italy and I move on Russia. You also have to
push your fleet through to the med. This does indeed leave you with a single
fleet in BRE.
This does leave him free to join forces with IR after the spring move
leaving us in a bad light by saying "hey GF obviously have something going,
let the 3 of us gang up on them".
As you pointed out he will be very strong with all his fleets amd a major
threat to you. Especially if Italy joins him and builds fleet too. I would
be to busy fighting off Russia.
Do you think England would do all that? the only problem we have is that our
moves are attacking moves on our neighbours. His arent and he can change
sides for the fall, we cant as we have committed ourselves.
Do you want to move on him in the spring? Maybe we should discuss this
further. Let me know.
Message from France to England and Germany
So let me just confirm the moves for S01:
England:
F Edi - Nwg
F Lon - Nth
A Lvp - Yor (or are you heading to Edi instead?)
France:
F Bre - Mao
A Par - Gas
A Mar - Pie
Germany:
F Kiel - Den
A Ber - Pru
A Mun - Sil
I should also note that I've been telling other powers that the extent of
our negotiations has been a deal surrounding the disposition of Belgium:
if anyone asks, we should all stick to the story that we've agreed to let
England take Belgium with a fleet. Details beyond that are up to each of
you. I'm also telling people that I've had friendly and lengthy but
ultimately non-commital discussions with both of you.
Message from France to Germany
>
> Do you think England would do all that? the only problem we have is that
> our
> moves are attacking moves on our neighbours. His arent and he can change
> sides for the fall, we cant as we have committed ourselves.
Interesting dimension -- I was thinking tactically that he had an
advantage, but he's also got a bit of a diplomatic advantage, too.
I suppose much of this hinges on what Turkey and Austria are planning. If
Austria is going after Italy in the first year, then Italy's in a world of
trouble. Even if he and England start working together, he may not be able
to field enough of an offense to be a problem for me.
I really doubt Turkey is attacking Russia early, but once he sees you and
England headed in for the kill, he might be easily convinced to join in
the fray. In fact, I suspect that's exactly the sort of wait-and-see plan
that he's using.
So, our ability to deal with England long-term depends on our ability to
pull Austria and Turkey into conflict with each of our targets. Tell you
what: we move as we're planning right now. If it's clear that AI are
allied and that T isn't going to hit Russia, then we can still back out:
neither of us is overcommited, Russia won't be too miffed because you
won't have bounced him in Sweden yet, and while Italy will still be a
problem for me, I can get the two builds from Por and Spa and be able to
field a fleet in Brest while holding off Italy if diplomacy fails.
If Italy and Russia are being attacked from multiple sides, though, then I
think this triple has a real benefit for all of us, even if England has
some minor advantage in the end. In that event, we continue on
through '02, pick up our additional builds, finish off Russia, and
encourage Turkey and what's left of Italy to squeeze out Austria while we
build fleets, double back and take on England. S03 a long way away, of
course, but at least this gives us a roadmap. If things really change, we
adjust and deal with them.
For now, though, we really need to pile on the press and get Austria and
Turkey working towards Italy and Russia. Agreed?
Erik
Message from Germany to England and France
Thats what it says on the site, and the site is easy to follow. So yes I can
cofirm them. Set wait has also been done.
Message from England to France and Germany
> So let me just confirm the moves for S01:
>
> England:
> F Edi - Nwg
> F Lon - Nth
> A Lvp - Yor (or are you heading to Edi instead?)
I'd set EDI, but YOR makes more sense, so I'll switch it.
>
> France:
> F Bre - Mao
> A Par - Gas
> A Mar - Pie
>
> Germany:
> F Kiel - Den
> A Ber - Pru
> A Mun - Sil
>
> I should also note that I've been telling other powers that the extent of
> our negotiations has been a deal surrounding the disposition of Belgium:
> if anyone asks, we should all stick to the story that we've agreed to let
> England take Belgium with a fleet. Details beyond that are up to each of
> you. I'm also telling people that I've had friendly and lengthy but
> ultimately non-commital discussions with both of you.
Ok, my orders are in. I am setting no wait.
Ben
Message from Austria to Germany
> I have spoken to Russia, he informed me that the pair of you were still working on the GAL situation (to bounce or not to bounce).
It's been settle. We will not bounce in Gal.
> Apart from that I am still awaiting some communication to confirm the cooporation between all 4 of us else AIG go it alone and
await Russia's spring moves.
> I am still in negotiations with Russia, he ofcourse is insisting that I dont bounce him in Sweden. I said that I would not as long
as I had no reason to do so. I also coupled the AR coming to agreemnt on GAL as part of this agreement. So if he does doubble cross
you then you can count on me.
>
What's left to discuss exactly? Also, do you intend to keep a
unit in Munich just in case or do you trust Andy completely?
Philippe
Message from France to Germany
Okay, looks like everything's set. Looking at the plan, I think we're in
good shape. We can switch courses very quickly, either in F01 or S02.
England's attack against Russia can do nothing but help you spread out the
Russian defense, and F MAO can go to Iri as easily as Wes. When I double
back, England will be forced to build and move to cover me, and in the
process, will leave a hole open for your build of F Kiel.
And hey -- if the first season goes well and other players move
accordingly, we may have reason to continue with the triple until S02.
The biggest potential problems I see are:
1.) A friendly R/T or R/A, which would let Russia focus on you and
potentially partner with England against us. If T or A or both are hostile
or neutral, Russia will be more than willing to let you pull back and
attack England while he deals with the south.
2.) An AI alliance. I'd heard plenty of initial reports of AI getting
along swimmingly, and Austria has been vague when I've probed him about
attacking Italy. Are you at all worried about this, even with your belief
that A Trieste is headed for Venice and the DMZ in Tyrolia?
Erik
Message from Germany to France
Well if AI are having problems negotiating then maybe we should help them
along ;-)
As you pointed out the Italian is a little concerned about me anyway.
The turk has been very quiet. Maybe you can inquire as to how the
relationship AT is going.
I too will poke around a little and get back to you
Message from Germany to Austria
Well I am still trying to find out if he can spae a unit north. WIth you and
him beating up on austria then he has enough units south. MOS could head
north but he seems relucttant to do so.
Well france wants to bounce in BUR so MUN will remain where it is after the
bounce.
Message from Germany to England and France
I have told Austria that France and I are to bounce in BUR, he wanted to
know if my unit was remaining in MUN.
So if he decides somehow to verify it with either of you in a roundabout way
then you can confirm it.
Message from Germany to France
Yes quite secure. The east seems to be tied down with paranoia. They are all
insisting om bounces. The only risk I run
is TYR but seen as VEN is ment to bounce then VEN wont move to TYR or PIE. I
dont see Italy bouncing ROM in VEN just to get to TYR or PIE.
Message from Germany to England and France
I am trying to find out the relationship between austria and Russia and to
some extent Turkey and Italy.
I have told the austrian that I am trying to get the russian go north, just
to see if this filters back somehow. If russia approaches england then we
know where austria stands.
Message from Germany to Austria
*** darn my fat fingers and rushing, here is the correct text including a
better spelling ***
Well I am still trying to find out if he can spare a unit north. With you
and
him beating up on Turkey then he has enough units south. MOS could head
north but he seems reluctant to do so. Well france wants to bounce in BUR so
MUN will remain where it is after the
bounce.
Message from England to France and Germany
Gentlemen -
Russia indeed told me he was being "pressured" to open north.
Anyway I've now set nowait. Let's get it on!
Ben
Message from Austria to Germany
OK. Thanks for the heads up.
Philippe
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
Any idea what we're waiting for?
*yawn*
Ben
Message from France to Germany
Tony:
Since Austria seems to have a relationship with Russia, as your e-mail
bait demonstrated, are you worried about the effectiveness of your initial
attack? Even if they're not committed to mutual defense, it's obviously
better for you (and the triple) if Austria's willing to at least look the
other way while you attack Russia.
Austria's been hesitant to get involved in any kind of joint attack
against Italy; I guess he and and Russia must be planning an attack on
Turkey. Given Turkey's non-communication, this isn't particularly
surprising. Still, I wish Austria could be more involved in helping out
our immediate attacks. If you've got any sort of relationship with him,
maybe you can get him out of Russia's camp and into ours.
Erik
Message from Germany to France
Will look into it. I was initially involed long ago in talking with AI but
they couldnt sort out the VEN bounce.
I havent spoken to him since. Will see whats happening.
Message from Germany to England
No Ben I can only assume that the eastern powers havent got their act sorted
out yet.
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
> No Ben I can only assume that the eastern powers
> havent got their act sorted out yet.
Sigh. I suppose I knew that. Just bored. I guess it's too much to ask for S'01 to process before the deadline. . .
Ben
Message from Germany to Germany
Well, I wasnt able to ensure that AI were on board. They probably have one
foot in the boat.
The EFG is a probability, I am sure England is willing.
Austria claiming there wont be bounce leeds me to believe that Russia will
be coming to SIL, he or someone has mentioned the push north to england.
If EG are JDPR players then I may find them pushing for me as soon as s1901
along with A or I.
I will try another round of talks and see what comes up.
Message from Germany to Russia
I hear you are not bouncing in GAL. I just thought that I would let you know
that due to lack of 3 way communication I have a gut feeling that AT are
allied. England has been informed of the suggested push north by Russia, so
be careful.
Message from Germany to Italy
So what is happening, I know France and Austria are talking. Have you heared
anything yet
Message from Germany to Turkey
It was nice knowing you ;-) good luck.
Message from Germany to Austria
Hmmm your name has popped up a few times, be careful. You heared anything
new?
Message from Italy to Germany
>
> So what is happening, I know France and Austria are talking. Have you heared
> anything yet
>
Not a thing, but if they get together I am not in good shape....
Message from Austria to Germany
> Hmmm your name has popped up a few times, be careful. You heared anything
> new?
I haven't heard anything special nor have I done anything special,
so could you enlighthen me? I would really appreciate knowing
what this name dropping is all about.
Philippe
Message from Germany to Austria
Well I have heared that turkey and russia are talking and that that spelt
trouble for you. I wasnt worried as this still means that aig are looking
strong if we stick together. I do find it a little strange that russia hasnt
got back to aig in one press.
There again maybe the RT was only dropped to cause confusion. How is it
between you and russia?
How is the relationship with Italy? The three of us havent spoken.
Message from Germany to Austria and Italy
What are you guys hearing. I am hearing RT and ER. I also hear that AI are
doing ok. The last one is good news but have you heared rumors? How come we
havent heared from Russia in a global press to us? do we count him out?
We probably wont be getting down to businees in the spring due to the VEN
bounce but hopefully by fall we will all be on board.
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
>
> What are you guys hearing. I am hearing RT and ER. I also hear that AI are
> doing ok.
We are ok.
The last one is good news but have you heared rumors? How come we
> havent heared from Russia in a global press to us?
The rumours I have heard center around France and Austria jumping me.
I know they cant be true because of my relationship with GA.
do we count him out?
I think you should ask him.
> We probably wont be getting down to businees in the spring due to the VEN
> bounce but hopefully by fall we will all be on board.
Exactly.
Andy
Message from France to England and Germany
Sure enough, Germany came asking about the bounce in Burgundy. All of your
information bait is catching fish, Tony. I think our assault will go
splendidly.
Wish we knew what Turkey was up to, though.
Erik
Message from England to France and Germany
Tony -
> Sure enough, Germany came asking about the bounce in
> Burgundy. All of your
> information bait is catching fish, Tony. I think our assault will go
> splendidly.
Would you remind me again what we learn from all this, Tony?
> Wish we knew what Turkey was up to, though.
I have a press in to him & will let you guys know what he has in mind, when
I hear from him.
Ben
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> > What are you guys hearing. I am hearing RT and ER. I also hear that AI are
> > doing ok.
>
> We are ok.
>
> The last one is good news but have you heared rumors? How come we
> > havent heared from Russia in a global press to us?
>
> The rumours I have heard center around France and Austria jumping me.
>
> I know they cant be true because of my relationship with GA.
There's no need to worry on my account. I'm committed to AGI
and even if I weren't, I can't see the point of attacking Italy right
off the bat.
> do we count him out?
>
> I think you should ask him.
I think Russia was a bit put off by the joint press, but even after,
I still got a good feeling from his press. Of course, if there's
rumours of RT, it could all just be a setup and I would need you
to bounce Sweden like we said.
> > We probably wont be getting down to businees in the spring due to the VEN
> > bounce but hopefully by fall we will all be on board.
>
> Exactly.
Yes, I look forward to finally know what's really happening
around the board.
Philippe
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
> > The rumours I have heard center around France and Austria jumping me.
> >
> > I know they cant be true because of my relationship with GA.
>
> There's no need to worry on my account. I'm committed to AGI
> and even if I weren't, I can't see the point of attacking Italy right
> off the bat.
Well....thats what you are doing.
And the specific rumour I have heard is that France is moving MAR - PIE
> Yes, I look forward to finally know what's really happening
> around the board.
As do I.
Andy
Message from Germany to England and France
Well I am not sure who erik meant when he said germany came asking about the
bounce in BUR.
I am assuming he means austria or italy.
Italy thinks AF are after him. I think we are the only ones who seem to have
a solid agreement.
The only thing I dont hear of is the ER relation. Maybe you are buttering
him up ;-)
Message from Germany to Russia
Well how are things going, Austria informs me of a no bounce in GAL. Was
wondering what you have to say?
Message from France to England and Germany
> Well I am not sure who erik meant when he said germany came asking about
> the
> bounce in BUR.
> I am assuming he means austria or italy.
Sorry, typo. It was actually *Russia* that asked.
Erik
Message from Russia to Germany
>I hear you are not bouncing in GAL.
Yes, we're back to the DMZ.
>I just thought that I would let you know
>that due to lack of 3 way communication I have a gut feeling that AT are
>allied. England has been informed of the suggested push north by Russia, so
>be careful.
I am concerned about AT as well. Neither A or T have said anything
that implies they are coming after me, but of course, they wouldn't.
Because of that I'll want to keep my units around to defend the
borders should Austria take Gal, Turkey take Arm or a combination of
the two. That also means I won't be going north this season.
Which is just as well, I think. If AT doesn't come to be, I'll be in
a good position to work with one or the other of them, and possibly
build in the north to work on England (if I get builds). I assume
from your earlier messages that if I have the choice you would prefer
me to work with Austria as opposed to Turkey. For now I'll be seeing
how they move before getting too set one way or the other in any case.
Let me know if your preferences change (or if I'm wrong about them),
as I'll definitely keep them in mind -- it'll be easier for us to
cooperate in the north if things in the south are not worrying to you.
--- Tzarface
Message from Germany to England and France
Well if it was Russia then that may point to a possible Russian move on me
or england. That would at worst make me bounce in either sil or pru. I will
still be able to bounce him in Sweden so we would still come out on top.
Its not that Russia is hoping for a GR against England which would be the
case if I was against france. So I wonder what and more important with whom
he will share this information.
An anti English or anti german opening by russia does not effect our plans.
If at worst he pushes mos to stp then england is still strong enough to take
norway with 2 units.
I will mention this inquiry into BUR to Russia to see how he reacts ;-)
Message from Germany to Russia
I hear you were inquiring about my bounce in BUR. Ask and I will tell you my
moves.
Message from Germany to France
Hmmm if it was Russia then this may point to an RE alliance. What do you
think? I will inform russia that i will open kie -den (request of austria),
mun - bur (to an agreed bounce) and ber - kie. A pretty standard opening.
Message from Germany to all
OK, so here it is. MUN - BUR (agreed bounce with France), KIE - DEN (on
request), BER - KIE. Pretty standard opening I would say. Anyone else like
to share?
Message from Germany to Russia
Our press just crossed. I am just wondering who mentioned the push north to
England. It could have only been Italy, Austria or yourself. I dont see
Italy doing it. That would only leave Austria and you. You would only do it
if you were after me with France or England. Something at this stage which i
doubt. That leaves Austria. If it was him then he mentioned it for a reason.
I will only state what I stated from the beginning. I have never seen
germany move on russia or vice versa.
My main concern is being on the right side on E or F. One of the three
always loses out to the other two.
It was Austria who requested my move to DEN to bounce you if needed. I wont
be moving on SIL, PRU or SWE no matter what you hear. A GR war would spell
disaster for me.
By fall I will be letting you into Sweden and no doubt something will happen
down south.
Message from France to Germany
>
> Hmmm if it was Russia then this may point to an RE alliance. What do you
> think? I will inform russia that i will open kie -den (request of
> austria),
> mun - bur (to an agreed bounce) and ber - kie. A pretty standard
> opening.
>
I don't doubt that RE are on good speaking terms, but I can't imagine that
England would jeopardize his against against Russia that early. He's
probably just laying the groundwork for a later turn.
I wouldn't ask Russia about that Burgundy inquiry, if I were you. It will
tell him that we're sharing that kind of information (who asked whom
about) very quickly, and certainly put him on alert. It would be wiser to
let sleeping dogs lie.
Erik
Message from Germany to France
Russia just contacted me. He is a little weary of an AT alliance. Something
I doubt as Turkey hardly speaks. I have broadcasted my moves ;-) just to see
what happens.
Englans is safe anyway as long as you dont go to ENG. As you said we can
always double back if need be in the fall. The opening does allow the
covering of all home sc's.
Message from France to Germany
> I doubt as Turkey hardly speaks. I have broadcasted my moves ;-) just to
> see
> what happens.
Yes, I noticed. Kind of shreds your credibility after this opening though,
doesn't it? If we need to double back on England, say, aren't you worried
about a lack of trust on A/I/R's part?
Erik
Message from Germany to Italy
Its just hit me are you sure about Austria?
What is to stop him moving to TYR and having two units on VEN?
Did you agree to hold in VEN or bounce him in TRI?
Maybe ROM - APU as a back up is wise. If the 3 of us are together by fall
then the fleet can always take TUN. This would allow an easy fleet build to
head west along with ven - pie. I prefer that move in the spring but that
would mean rom - ven to bounce with tri. That would mean nap - tys to convoy
to tun. A little awkward, just a thought though onvie - tyr. He says he has
a dmz in gal. Then where is vie going? is it going to bud?
Maybe you should insist on a bounce in tyr. This still allows him to move
tri - ven.
Message from Germany to France
Nahhhh. It never was to be. Just have to sow some doubt in their minds. I
usually findt that when I play a listed names game then I usually find all 6
coming after me. The real diplomacy wont start until the fall.
As for shreading credibility I recall the last comment game. All three
neighbours of england lied remember ;-)
We tend to talk the most so hopefully EG are set for a long relation. Thats
more than anyone can hope for after the spring of 1901.
IA are a little worried about each other, so is rusia regarding AT. That
just leaves the three of us to work things out which we have. I may have it
all wrong but as I said the real diplomacy wont start until the fall.
Initially I asked Italy to move on you and Russia to move on ENgland, just
standard diplomacy reducing any risk of an EF against me. In the meantime I
try to make friends with at least one of you. Its england I have the most
worries about. He seems new and fresh but the ER is a little worrying.
Personally I think Russia will come after me with or without austrias or
italys help.
If worst comes to the worst let two strong neighbours bearing down on you
come to a head to head around you then play one out against the other. There
is always one greedier than the other.
I have gone back down to one sc many times and still survived into a draw
;-)
Announce some moves or at least the bounce in BUR just to see what happens.
Full open press sometimes leads to interesting developments, especially near
a deadline !
Message from Italy to Germany
>
> Its just hit me are you sure about Austria?
Hell no.
> What is to stop him moving to TYR and having two units on VEN?
Nothing, and if the French go to Piedmont, they can force Venice, even if
I go to Apulia from Rome.
> Did you agree to hold in VEN or bounce him in TRI?
He is attacking Venice from Trieste, I have to hold
> Maybe ROM - APU as a back up is wise. If the 3 of us are together by fall
> then the fleet can always take TUN.
Right.
This would allow an easy fleet build to
> head west along with ven - pie. I prefer that move in the spring but that
> would mean rom - ven to bounce with tri. That would mean nap - tys to convoy
> to tun. A little awkward, just a thought though onvie - tyr. He says he has
> a dmz in gal. Then where is vie going? is it going to bud?
> Maybe you should insist on a bounce in tyr. This still allows him to move
> tri - ven.
He has refused every other option I have put forward to him.
If you want to understand the history I have with the French player...just
look at the game sete on USVG.....the setup will be quite familiar, he has
already told me that anything that even looks in the slightest way
offensive towards him will be met with all his units.
This is why I am so guarded....
Message from Germany to France
>We tend to talk the most so hopefully EG are set for a long relation.>
Hmm fat fingers and nearing bed time, that was ment to be FG ;-)>
Message from Germany to Italy
Hmmm interesting. I have never let past experiences effect a new game. I
always follow the board.
But i did find austria's demands a little far fetched. You should at least
move ven - tri to bounce.
I dont see him moving to adr and then push bud - tri but at least moving to
tri is the same as holding ven.
This would leave tyr open if i were hostile. Why not insist on a bounce in
tyr? this also takes care of the tri - ven.
He does seem paranoid about tri and an italian stab. The french hasnt
mentioned austria at all.
I dont think they are allied. Well if you really want to be safe order ven -
pie and rom - ven. If i was allied with france against you then he would be
moving to pie and I would be moving to tri.
I just wish we could have gotten a clear commitment from austria.
Message from Germany to Italy
>If i was allied with france against you then he would be
moving to pie and I would be moving to tri.>
Its late and bed time. I ment I would be moving to tyr not tri.
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
Philippe,
I am having one of those really bad gut feelings about this first turn...
how about if we bounce in Tyrolia and Venice.
Is that ok with you??
Andy
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> I am having one of those really bad gut feelings about this first turn...
>
> how about if we bounce in Tyrolia and Venice.
>
> Is that ok with you??
To be frank, I would rather not but will feel obligated to if
you insist. We are allies and I will do what I can to ease
your worries; but with the threat of getting bounced in
Sweden, I believe Russia will abstain from moving against
me right away and this give me the opportunity of going for
Vie-Bud-ser & Bud-Ser-gre for a shot at two builds or at
least make sure Turkey won't.
Philippe.
P.-S. In case you wonder, no I don't trust Russia more then
Italy in 1901; but contrarily to Italy, he can be denied a build
for even attempting to attack Austria. That's why I'm still
going with Tri-Ven.
Message from Russia to Germany
>I hear you were inquiring about my bounce in BUR. Ask and I will tell you my
>moves.
The question (are you bouncing in Bur) really just came up on the
spur of the moment. I only asked because France had asked right
before whether I was going to bounce in Gal, and it seemed only fair
to ask about Bur in return. I really should have asked you the same
question, but when France said you had asked for a bounce, I couldn't
see any reason why he would lie, and so never bothered to follow up
with you.
>Our press just crossed. I am just wondering who mentioned the push north to
>England. It could have only been Italy, Austria or yourself. I dont see
>Italy doing it. That would only leave Austria and you.
Sorry to rob the mystery from the whole thing, but I talked in some
detail with England about the concept of a northern opening. England
asked me if I was going to be opening north, and I told him that I
would not. I told him that was in part because I've had multiple
people ask whether I was considering a northern opening, and I
thought that meant an AT v R was forming.
The point of the statement was to make it clear that no discussions
about a northern opening were going forward. Since -- as I said in my
last press to you -- I've decided not to open north, I didn't see any
problem with being open about it. I thought that this statement plus
my concern about a possible AT, would actually give England more
flexibility to work with you.
To be honest, I didn't think that the fact that people had talked to
me about a northern opening *in concept* would be a big deal -- I
generally assume that my neighbors discuss lots of options, at least
casually, before the first moves. I certainly never said that
anything was planned or coordination.
>You would only do it if you were after me with France or England.
>Something at this stage which i doubt.
I am firmly focused in the south, and on the potential of combatting
an AT. I don't want to see you go down, because you're my only buffer
if that happens. Italy can hound Austria, but you are the only one
with units that can support me.
>That leaves Austria. If it was him then he mentioned it for a reason.
Obviously I cannot speak as to what Austria may have told England. If
we assume an AT alliance is happening, then perhaps he wants England
pressuring me in the north? But again, it could just be what I said.
>My main concern is being on the right side on E or F. One of the three
>always loses out to the other two.
I've gotten the distinct impression from Ben that he's going to play
neutrally early and see how things go. If that's true, you still have
options with him. France I don't have a clear read on, but would
guess he's going to be flexible as well. If there's anything I can do
to help with either E or F, let me know. Especially with E, because
now I feel like I may have caused problems for you!
>I wont be moving on SIL, PRU or SWE no matter what you hear. A GR
>war would spell disaster for me.
And I won't be moving on Sil or Pru, because a GR war is just as bad
for me. Reading this I realize I don't remember accepting your
request for DMZ Boh, so I'll also say yes here. (I never had a
problem with it, but I don't know that I ever agreed to it either.
I'm quite happy with a Boh DMZ, and have no expectation of getting
that far for a while in any case.
Again, I'm sorry if my interactions with England and France have made
you nervous about our relationship. Obviously that was not the intent
in either case.
--- Tzarface
Message from England to France and Germany
Russian move on Germany or me says one thing to me, and that begins with a
J and rhymes with puggernaut.
Ben
Message from Italy to Austria and Germany
>
> > I am having one of those really bad gut feelings about this first turn...
> >
> > how about if we bounce in Tyrolia and Venice.
> >
> > Is that ok with you??
>
> To be frank,
to be frank, I dont see any reason for you to need to hedgehog, but you
are.
I would rather not but will feel obligated to if
> you insist. We are allies and I will do what I can to ease
> your worries; but with the threat of getting bounced in
> Sweden, I believe Russia will abstain from moving against
> me right away and this give me the opportunity of going for
> Vie-Bud-ser & Bud-Ser-gre for a shot at two builds or at
> least make sure Turkey won't.
No.....no need to....I have to trust you at some level.
thanks for the quick response.
Andy
Message from Turkey to Germany
Thanks, take care yourself.
jason
Message from England to France and Germany
From what I hear from Italy, I'm guessing MAR - PIE will succeed.
Ben
Message from France to Germany
> Nahhhh. It never was to be. Just have to sow some doubt in their minds.
> I
> usually findt that when I play a listed names game then I usually find
> all 6
> coming after me. The real diplomacy wont start until the fall.
> As for shreading credibility I recall the last comment game. All three
> neighbours of england lied remember ;-)
Hey, I'm not saying you shouldn't lie. Just want to make sure what you're
doing. I think, as you do, that there's enough suspicion in this game
between the eastern powers that a bold broadcast lie isn't going to make
much of a difference in the long run.
> Its england I have the
> most
> worries about. He seems new and fresh but the ER is a little worrying.
> Personally I think Russia will come after me with or without austrias or
> italys help.
Once again, Austria and Turkey are the key to preventing any kind of
threat from ER. As long as Russia has other headaches to deal with, he'll
be less inclined to lift much of a finger to help England, especially
once you've called off or halted your attack (after taking Warsaw, of
course). I'm not too worried about ER, though we clearly want to keep an
eye out for it.
I think a German move on you signals confidence in his relationship with
England, but if England moves north as planned, how long will that
confidence last? I see a lot of eastern powers getting very flustered by
our opening.
Erik
Message from Germany to England
hehehehe I must pay more attention to names, I see you are GM-ing the game LORAX in which I play Turkey. Now that is a tough game. Just thought it funny enough to mention. It goes to prove that I never pay attention to names and past experiences with players.
Message from England to Germany
Tony -
> hehehehe I must pay more attention to names, I see you are
> GM-ing the game LORAX in which I play Turkey. Now that is a
> tough game.
You know, when we started in C2, I said to myself, Tony's address is
*really* familiar. Where do I know it from. . . I must have looked at
every other game I'm gm'ing. I just overlooked Lorax, I guess. In the end
I told myself I'd seen your name on VG or r.g.d. a few times.
Makes me regret ignoring all the partial press. . .
;-)
Ben
Message from Austria to Germany and Italy
> thanks for the quick response.
No problem, when I can I do; but it's not
always possible given my internet access.
Philippe
Message to all
> OK, so here it is. MUN - BUR (agreed bounce with France), KIE - DEN (on
> request), BER - KIE. Pretty standard opening I would say. Anyone else like
> to share?
Can we expect you to keep this up?
Message from Germany to all
<Can we expect you to keep this up?>
Who are 'we'? some of you can some of you cant. Those that expect will
receive ;-)
So, no one else willing to lie.. I mean share their opening moves?
Turkey; just to save on press and answer in this one, the answer is NO.
I will not be asking France and Italy to convoy me to SMY nor will I aid in
any EFI convoy of a Russian unit from STP to CON.
Message from England to all
> I will not be asking France and Italy to convoy me to SMY nor
> will I aid in any EFI convoy of a Russian unit from STP to CON.
My suggestion was for a convoy of a Russian army from NAF to STP, via the
Eastern Med. Please read your press more carefully.
My opening moves are:
F STP/sc - BOT
A MOS - WAR
A WAR - MOS
F SEV - ION
This way I maximize my defensive posture and bounce Italy from the Ionian.
Ben
Austria: Army Budapest → Serbia
Austria: Fleet Trieste → Venice (*bounce*)
Austria: Army Vienna → Budapest
England: Fleet Edinburgh → Norwegian Sea
England: Army Liverpool → Yorkshire
England: Fleet London → North Sea
France: Fleet Brest → Mid-Atlantic Ocean
France: Army Marseilles → Piedmont
France: Army Paris → Gascony
Germany: Army Berlin → Kiel
Germany: Fleet Kiel → Denmark
Germany: Army Munich → Ruhr
Italy: Fleet Naples → Ionian Sea
Italy: Army Rome → Apulia
Italy: Army Venice HOLD
Russia: Army Moscow HOLD
Russia: Fleet Sevastopol → Black Sea (*bounce*)
Russia: Fleet St Petersburg (south coast) → Gulf of Bothnia
Russia: Army Warsaw → Ukraine
Turkey: Fleet Ankara → Black Sea (*bounce*)
Turkey: Army Constantinople → Bulgaria
Turkey: Army Smyrna → Armenia
|