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England: Builds 2 units
France: Builds 2 units
Germany: Removes 3 units
Russia: Builds 1 unit
Message from Russia to all
>Movement results for Fall of 1907. (titleist.029)
>
>England: 8 Supply centers, 6 Units: Builds 2 units.
>France: 9 Supply centers, 7 Units: Builds 2 units.
>Germany: 0 Supply centers, 3 Units: Removes 3 units.
>Italy: 8 Supply centers, 8 Units: Builds 0 units.
>Russia: 4 Supply centers, 3 Units: Builds 1 unit.
>Turkey: 5 Supply centers, 5 Units: Builds 0 units.
Hmmm, lied to, and/or stabbed by three different Powers,
and I still gained a Center. Interesting...
Message from Italy to Russia
>
> Hmmm, lied to, and/or stabbed by three different Powers,
> and I still gained a Center. Interesting...
>
But nowhere to build unfortunately.
Germany and Turkey seem obvious decievers.
I assume England was the 3rd. What was it that he lied about?
Or was it me? Quickly checking my records, I don't think so.
Idalia
Message from Russia to Italy
>Message from Italy to Russia in 'titleist':
> >
> > Hmmm, lied to, and/or stabbed by three different Powers,
> > and I still gained a Center. Interesting...
> >
>
>But nowhere to build unfortunately.
Yes, that's why I said I gained a Center, rather than
a build.
>Germany and Turkey seem obvious deceivers.
>I assume England was the 3rd. What was it that he lied about?
Actually, England and Turkey stabbed, while England
and France lied. England was supposed to leave Swe
and Den open, and France was supposed to go slow
against you. Ali, the fool, just stabbed, he didn't
even have the decency to lie to me.
Nick.
Message from England to all
Fredd,
I enjoyed our partnership. Seriously.
And we still have eight units between us!
Take care.
Ivy
Message from Turkey to Italy
Roberto,
Is there nothing I can do to get you to cease your hostilities against me? Is
there nothing I can say to convince you to even talk to me?
I *still* do not understand your motivations here. You seem to be holding out
hope that England will attack France as a result of your throwing centers to
him. But England still has lots of opportunities without even looking at
France, and I will do what little I can to keep him on that track.
It is clear that you'll be able to eliminate me before France can eliminate
you. But then what do you do, hole up in Austria and hope you never lose any
units, and that you can work your way into a 3-way? I suppose it's possible,
but I think it highly unlikely you'll be able to survive in a draw without
your homeland. And if you go back to reclaim your home centers after the fact
then (1) they'll be difficult to regain, and (2) that essentially just throws
the game to England, which doesn't do you much good does it?
If you've lost interest in the game, and have simply decided to suicide in
some spectacular way, well, I guess that's your choice. But in my opinion,
frankly, it degrades an otherwise good game, and I think it's a damn shame.
Ali
Message from Master to all
Thank you for playing, Germany. The end came much more suddenly
than I expected! Please write up an EOG statement and "press to m"
(or broadcast, if you prefer). You can also write one at game's
end, but I'd prefer one now, if it's not too much trouble.
Doug
Message from Italy to Turkey
Have you never made an error in judgement before in a Diplomacy game?
Rhetorical question, no need to answer.
It's a damn shame I stabbed you.
It's a damn shame Germany moved to Tyrolia.
It's a damn shame France moved to the West Med.
The game is full of damn shames. In a normal Diplomacy game, you'd have a
very strong position right now as Italy would have moved to defend against
France. But, this isn't a normal Diplomacy game now is it. If you haven't
figured that out yet, you haven't been paying attention.
There was one time, and one time only, in this game that you should have
trusted me. It's a damn shame you didn't.
> Is there nothing I can do to get you to cease
> your hostilities against me?
No, not any more.
Idalia
Message from Italy to England
This message probably won't come as a surprise to you, but I'll tell you
anyway so it's on the record.
I will continue my attack against Turkey and I will not move to stop France
from taking what I leave behind. If that means he reaches 18, so be it.
I'll be happy that the game is over.
Idalia
Message from England to Italy
>This message probably won't come as a surprise to you, but I'll tell you
>anyway so it's on the record.
>
>I will continue my attack against Turkey and I will not move to stop France
>from taking what I leave behind. If that means he reaches 18, so be it.
>I'll be happy that the game is over.
Thank you for the courtesy of notifying me. I do have one question.
What do you wish to do if you are dug in at Turkey's location and France
does not yet have 18? Will you defend? Would you be interested in
fighting your way back west with the understanding that I would be handing
you some of my centers so that we could work for the natural 17-17 line?
Ivy
Message from Italy to England
>
> What do you wish to do if you are dug in at Turkey's location
> and France does not yet have 18? Will you defend?
>
I'm not sure yet. You'll have to ask me again if the situation were to
arise. It could go either way.
If I were forced to answer today, I'd say I wouldn't defend.
Idalia
Message from Turkey to Italy
Well, at least I finally got you to reply.
> There was one time, and one time only, in this game that you should have
> trusted me. It's a damn shame you didn't.
What would make me trust you after you'd stabbed me twice?
Why did everything rest on that one action?
Why do you not even care that you're losing your home centers?
Message from Italy to Turkey
>
> What would make me trust you after you'd stabbed me twice?
>
Your Diplomacy intuition that you were patting yourself on the back with
earlier in the game.
> Why did everything rest on that one action?
>
Because I said so.
> Why do you not even care that you're losing your home centers?
>
Because I don't.
Idalia
Message from Master to Italy
usin@thekleimans.com said:
>Message from [klofgren@santarosa.edu as] Italy to England in 'titleist':
>
>If I were forced to answer today, I'd say I wouldn't defend.
Is this truly your sentiment, or a negotiation tactic? If the former,
I'm a little saddened that you have so little interest left in the
game. I think we all care a little less than we did before September
11, but I didn't think it had come to this.
Or is this a reflection of the fact that the "Titleist" will be the
player with the most SC's and you don't see that as a possibility for
you now?
It's not really my business, but I am curious.
Doug
Message from Turkey to Italy
You certainly sound very bitter. Hopefully some day I'll learn why that
bitterness is directed against me. Hopefully it at least has *something* to
do with my actions in this game.
Oh, and why are you signing your letters "Idalia"? Is that supposed to be
some kind of hint? Is the Archduke now controlling Italian units? That would
explain much, I suppose.
Ali
Message from Italy to Russia
>
> Actually, England and Turkey stabbed, while England
> and France lied. England was supposed to leave Swe
> and Den open, and France was supposed to go slow
> against you.
>
Sounds like your usefullness to EF has run its course but I'm sure you knew
that would happen with the annihilation of Germany.
Idalia
Message from Italy to Master
> >
> >If I were forced to answer today, I'd say I wouldn't defend.
>
> Is this truly your sentiment, or a negotiation tactic?
>
A little of both perhaps but I'd say it leans slightly more to the latter
than the former. I see no reason why I should defend if England does
nothing to stop France from putting me in that position.
> If the former,
> I'm a little saddened that you have so little interest left in the
> game. I think we all care a little less than we did before September
> 11, but I didn't think it had come to this.
>
The truth of the matter is, I don't care the outcome of this game. It would
not bother me if the game were to end tomorrow.
Did I need more time? I'd say it's obvious I did. But how much more time
is anybody's guess. You may have had to wait years before I had the proper
frame of mind to continue as before.
I'm guessing you didn't have a 2 year old daughter to come home to that
night completely oblivious to the events of the day with her parents equally
mystified as to the type of world they were raising their only child.
Believe me, it makes you think long and hard about what life is really
about.
My sincere apologies if this turns out not to be the 'showcase' game you had
hoped for due to a suicidally deranged Italian.
Ken
Message from France to Italy
Roberto:
Congratulation on your continued progress against Turkey.
As promised, I took only the centers which you were
taking from Turkey. What exactly is your overall plan?
It would help if you could explain it to me.
I would like to negotiation a reduction in your size,
gradually as you press further east. Are you willing to
allow me to take one more center than you take from
Turkey? I might not be so interested in that if a
portion of your forces were centered in Russia where they
were a threat to England and not all staring back at me
in the Mediterranean. Perhaps if you answer my question
above (your plan), it would help me understand if this is
reasonable.
--Prince Boar
Message from France to all
I suggest that EoG statements be held private to the
end, but certainly can be sent to the master anytime.
Germany can of course broadcast anything
he chooses. I personally would like to know how
me managed all those dates in hot tubs! :-)
Seems like a more useful skill than knowing
stalemate lines!
France
Message from Germany to all
Germany EOG.
One message to cover the whole game. Boy that's a tough one, this
game has already taken much more time than I thought it would. So I'll
keep it short, or at least try.
The most important move of the game. That's easy. England going into
the North Sea. It forced me to pull back my attack on England, and to
pull out of helping England attack France. Of course, it's my belief
that that's exactly what England wanted. I was going to become too
powerful if I gobbled up Russia. Plus I believe that England had decided
that he couldn't get through France so might as well switch directions.
Every move he made from that move on was a swing of his forces toward
me. I knew it was coming, and made many attempts to counter, all to no
avail.
The most important date. Sept 11. It was during this spell that my
fate was sealed. I was pretty sure of the EF juggernaut in the west.
Therefore I needed builds right then. I approached Turkey about
supporting me against Russia, but he did not respond from Sept 11 until
the next moves processed. Obviously he didn't want to go in that
direction, but what really chapped my hide was that he spent weeks as
the silent type then he sent a message within hours of the moves
processing. I wouldn't talk to him the rest of my existence.
Friends or people that I enjoyed playing with. Nobody.
Austria and I must have exchanged 3 messages the whole game. Almost all
of my press to him went unanswered.
Italy - Decent enough except for my final move when he was supposed to
support me into WAR. Chalk up one more stab for Robbie.
Turkey - see above. What's the point of this game if you don't talk.
Russia - What a pain in the butt. Never could he be convinced of
mutually beneficial moves. Always he would go back to moves that would
solely benefit himself. This is why we fought the whole game. His last
laugh is that I'm out before him. My laugh is that he'll be gone very
very soon. I fail to see the difference.
England - I can see why he did what he did. He's much better off this
way. It'll be interesting to see if its him or France who wins.
I believe that he missed one of the best stab opportunities a little
while ago when he didn't attack France. I would have taken it.
France - Probably going to win. Playing a great game. Stalemated
Englands attack and got him to turn toward me. (I wonder how much press
it took to get England to go into the North Sea) He's also got Italy to
totally turn over his entire homeland to him. I wonder if he won't be
able to talk England into accepting 2nd place?
Fredd
Chow
richolver@home.com has resigned richolver@home.com
as Germany in game 'titleist'.
Message from Germany to all
> Broadcast message from France in 'titleist':
>
> I suggest that EoG statements be held private to the
> end, but certainly can be sent to the master anytime.
Ya gotta love it. The person who has sent out more press than anyone
whom I've ever played against, wants to be a censor.
What could any EOG message say that hasn't been said in private many
times?
I thought I'd do it now. I doubt if I'll care at the end. This game lost
it's importance for me about 6 weeks ago. Not that I think there should
be an asterick after the winners name. The winner (who ever it is) will
have certainly earned the title.
Stab you later
I'm looking at getting my own hot tub ;-)
Freddy
Message from Italy to France
> Congratulation on your continued progress against Turkey.
> As promised, I took only the centers which you were
> taking from Turkey.
>
Quite frankly, you got lucky unless you knew Turkey would be moving to
Moscow. Had Turkey defended Rumania, I would have to disband and I probably
wouldn't be replying to this message. But, since I don't have to disband, I
won't hold it against you.
> What exactly is your overall plan?
To make sure than England does not win. He has consistently spread blatant
lies about my intentions and has suggested pathetically poor tactical
manuevers throughout the game (wes-spa/sc was one fine example). In my
mind, he has not negotiated in good faith. You wouldn't believe the latest
if you read it yourself. I'll paraphrase:
If you're holed up in Turkey, will you be willing to fight your
way west under the assumption that I [England] would be giving
you my centers towards the natural 17/17 stalemate line.
Uhhh, yeah right.
> It would help if you could explain it to me.
I hope that explains it well enough. Bottom line, I want you to win this
game as the most deserving participant. God knows, I don't deserve to win.
But I would settle for anybody but England.
> I would like to negotiation a reduction in your size,
> gradually as you press further east.
Careful here. A reduction in my size begins to let Turkey off the hook and
gives me less opportunity to hit Northern Russia. However, I could probably
afford to pull the EAS fleet if I had to.
> Are you willing to allow me to take one more center than you take from
> Turkey? I might not be so interested in that if a
> portion of your forces were centered in Russia where they
> were a threat to England and not all staring back at me
> in the Mediterranean.
I'd be happy to position my units whereever you like as long as Turkey's
elimination was the immediate goal.
I was thinking something like:
eas - syr
ion - eas
aeg s ion - eas
In the fall, you could support syr-smy. In return, you could take one of my
centers. We can discuss the second center you talked about in the fall.
Idalia
Message from Russia to Italy
> Message from Italy to Russia in 'titleist':
> Sounds like your usefullness to EF has run its course but I'm sure
> you knew that would happen with the annihilation of Germany.
Actually, I expected them to keep me strong in hopes of gaining
my help when the EF conflict flared up again. I guess England
feared I'd aid France, rather than him. Of course, now I will, so
I'm not sure he's gained that much. Stabbing an ally for just a
Center or two is usually a bad idea. *shrug*
Do you plan to defend against France now, or can I invite you
into Ukr to split Mos and Sev?
Nick.
Message from Master to Italy
usin@thekleimans.com said:
>I'm guessing you didn't have a 2 year old daughter to come home to
>that night completely oblivious to the events of the day with her
>parents equally mystified as to the type of world they were raising
>their only child. Believe me, it makes you think long and hard about
>what life is really about.
You're right, I don't have a child. Of course, I didn't know you
had a child, either, so I wasn't leaping to any conclusions. My
best friend here at work has a daughter born in Feb 2000 and he's
going through much the same thing, so I think I can understand your
sentiment, though.
>My sincere apologies if this turns out not to be the 'showcase' game
>you had hoped for due to a suicidally deranged Italian.
No apology needed -- the game has been terrific and I think you've
done a fine job. You may not win (though I've seen stranger things
happen), but you've done better than others. And just like the
Academy Awards "the real prize is just being here". ;-)
Doug
England: BUILD Army Edinburgh
England: BUILD Army London
France: BUILD Fleet Brest
France: BUILD Army Marseilles
Germany: REMOVE Army Silesia
Germany: REMOVE Fleet Skagerrak
Germany: REMOVE Army Tyrolia
Russia: WAIVE
Centers
England: 8
France: 9
Italy: 8
Russia: 4
Turkey: 5
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