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Message from England to Italy
Andy -
You've been outed on r.g.d. by Eric H.:
> Message 7 in thread
> From: Eric Hunter (hunter90@comcast.not)
> Subject: Re: What's the most unbelievable thing
> you ever heard in a FTF game?
[snip]
> Yesterday in NYC Andy "Buffalo" Bartalone was
> playing England and Germany opened to Denmark,
> Prussia and Silesia in S '0, in spite of
> EVERYONE'S warnings (Corey Mason was Russia,
> Rick Desper was Italy, and I was Austria, so
> it's not like Buffalo was an unknown quantity
> on the board.
>
> The conversation between England and Germany
> prior to F '01. "He (Germany) walked up to me
> with about 1:30 left in negotiation time and
> said "If I see an army in Holland I am going to
> be very upset" and I (England) responded, "Well
> ....you are going to be very upset then." He
> said, "You aren't even going to lie to me?", and
> I said.... "Why should I?" He stared at me the
> way that dogs stare at helicopters."
etc.
Good story. Wasn't a tournament, was it?
I find it interesting that you speak with ellipses even when you are quoted
by others, by the way.
Ben
Message from England to England
Ok, Andy wants to get into MUN. This is probably good for me. It will be
non-Russian, so ER relations should actually *ease*, and in the end it could
make him large enough to permit me to go after Erik again, and I can return
to my fantasies of a solo arising out of some timely IR conflict. Mustn't
appear too eager, particularly not to Erik. . .
Ben
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
I don't think Eric will be taking SMY. Jason is a Janissary and he will be
supporting AEG - ION, is my guess.
Random thought at 4 a.m.
Ben
Message from England to France
Erik -
What do you think of Andy's proposal for TYR - MUN? If there comes a time
when we are working with Eric to simplify to a 3WD, I don't think it would
be a problem to take him out.
On the other hand, you don't want him biting the hand that feeds him. I'm
leaning toward agreeing to it, for the up-side, but before I speak to this
in a group press, I wanted to bounce it off you.
If there comes a time when EF rolls again, I would see it as French.
Ben
Message from Italy to England
Hi Ben,
> Andy -
> You've been outed on r.g.d. by Eric H.:
It appears I have...:-)
>
> Good story. Wasn't a tournament, was it?
No, it was a big house game on steriods....
4 boards, people from 8 or 9 states, Doug Massey included.
> I find it interesting that you speak with ellipses even when you are quoted
> by others, by the way.
Yes..
Message from Italy to England
Ben,
> I don't think Eric will be taking SMY. Jason is a Janissary and he will be
> supporting AEG - ION, is my guess.
And it will bounce. no harm no foul, I build a fleet and we support Erik
to he ION in the fall.
Andy
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
> No, it was a big house game on
> steriods....
Oh, to be footloose & fancy free. . .
Does anything happen in DC on weekdays?
Ben
Message from Italy to England
Ben,
> > No, it was a big house game on
> > steriods....
> Oh, to be footloose & fancy free. . .
yes.
>
> Does anything happen in DC on weekdays?
On holiday mondays sometimes.
But normally there isnt enough time.
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
> > Does anything happen in DC on weekdays?
>
> On holiday mondays sometimes.
>
> But normally there isnt enough time.
There is for me. Oh well.
Is it your understanding Erik agreed to the support for TYR - MUN?
Ben
Message from Italy to England
>
> Is it your understanding Erik agreed to the support for TYR - MUN?
>
Yes, but I am waiting on a confirmation.
Andy
Message from Italy to England and France
So....just to be absolutely clear.
our moves are as follows....and I would like confirmation from both of you
on this.
Italy
Tyr - Mun
Rom - Ven
Adr s Rom - Ven
England
Bar s Nwy - Stp
Nwy - Stp
Swe - Fin
Lvn - Mos
Bal s Kie - Ber
Kie - Ber
Hol - Kie
Ruh s Tyr - Mun
Nth - Nwy
Eng - Nth
Nao h
France
Bre h
Bur s Tyr - Mun
Lyo - Tys
Tys - Ion
Tun s Tys - Ion
Can we agree on this.
Andy
Message from France to England
> Erik -
> What do you think of Andy's proposal for TYR - MUN? If there
> comes a time when we are working with Eric to simplify to a
> 3WD, I don't think it would be a problem to take him out.
I think it's more advantageous to keep him at a net gain of zero, but on
the other hand, we can't afford an angry throw (which he's in a position
to do). With my build in Mar, though, and with a potential army build in
Nap, I suppose I can live with it.
I think we're moving toward a draw situation, but you never know. In any
case, I feel more secure in my position than I did a couple of turns
ago. Once we get St. P, I'll feel a lot better about the board in
general.
Let's go ahead and support the Tyr - Mun move. Better to knock the
Russian down one more center than leave Munich as it is.
Erik
Message from England to England
[press from France to me]
> > Erik -
> > What do you think of Andy's proposal for TYR - MUN? If there
> > comes a time when we are working with Eric to simplify to a
> > 3WD, I don't think it would be a problem to take him out.
>
> I think it's more advantageous to keep him at a net gain of zero, but on
Huzzah! A civil response. Great gains!
Ben
Message from England to France and Italy
Gentlemen -
Support for TYR - MUN, and the attack on STP, is ordered.
Ben
Message from Turkey to Russia
Sorry about the delay - work's been really crazy this week, and since
the deadline was long off...
I'll go ahead and head for Ion, with Aeg hopefully supporting. I agree
it's a long shot, but it's really all we've got in that theater right now.
jason
Message from Italy to England and France
Guys...
I am waiting to hear those confirmations.
Help me out here.
Andy
Message from England to France and Italy
> Guys...
> I am waiting to hear those confirmations.
I sent mine last week as I recall - support for TYR - MUN (& attack on STP)
is ordered.
> Help me out here.
Ok!
Ben
Message from Italy to England and France
Ok.....Erik....are you on board or not.
Andy
Message from France to England and Italy
>
> Ok.....Erik....are you on board or not.
>
> Andy
Yes, I'm on board. Busy day at work. Full confirmation or any comments will
come this evening.
Erik
Message from Italy to England and France
>
> Yes, I'm on board. Busy day at work. Full confirmation or any comments will
> come this evening.
Thank you
Im putting in my orders now.
Message from Russia to England
>Too bad for you, Mr. Stabber.
"Mr. Stabber"? :) I *told* you I was going to try for the solo. I don't
think it counts as a stab if I tell you it's coming, but if it does, that's
the easiest stab to defend against you'll ever get.
>Well, obviously a two-way will call for some (a) concessions or (b) poor
>guesses by you, as you currently have too many of the northern border
>provinces. But that can be arranged, in time, if you're serious.
I was, and I do think I already made the poor guesses, but to be honest,
I'm not expecting to see a set of moves that encourages a two way. If we
don't then I think I'd be ready to accept a three way -- I'm continuing to
have difficulty finding time for the game, and as the board resolves itself
the press aspect alone is less interesting.
> > Oh, and I'm out of town from mid-week to mid-week. So in addition to the
> > lovely delay I caused this week, I'll cause another next week. :)
>Oh, great. Mr. Tardy Stabber.
Well, Tardy lack-of-sticking-with-2-way more than anything. :)
--- Eric
Message from Russia to all
Sorry for the delay all,
I actually composed some press for each of you while I was offline, but
didn't get a chance to send it or my orders before leaving town last week.
But at least it looks like I did at least get back (just) in time to avoid
being late, despite my poor planning in setting absence.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Germany
>Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
:)
>Anyway the fact that EF called a truce was a problem anyway.
Yup, and that Italy trusted them by moving on me hurts as well.
>PIE - TYR is indeed a real pain. Oh well, I wonder if you will be able to
>diplome a 3 way with EF.
It seems entirely possible.
>I would sell the turk that the circumstances call for him to be kept in the
>draw until Italy is removed.
Yeah. He could help attack me, but the best that does is retreat me into
his last center. Unless he's playing for the unlikely five way.
>Good luck, it does indeed look like a threesome. I blame you anyway for not
>listening earlier ;-)
And I accept the blame, too. :)
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Italy
>I dont normally say something like this, but this is a *teaching* game for
>many of our observers...so I will...
>
>Never underestimate the short-sightedness of some players.
Unless you are referring to the possibility that Erik might attack you I'm
not sure what you mean.
>Erik and I have had that conversation and he knows the consequences of
>attacking me at this juncture.
I am sure you've had a conversation, but I can't see how you could make it
stick. If EF coordinate, F will get sufficient builds to ensure that he can
take at least one of your centers, and that's enough to keep me from
soloing. Even if they don't Erik gets pretty secure. And I'm not likely to
be able to hold a strong enough position to slow you down
> > I guess our interaction the last few turns makes it hard to differentiate
> > between an Eric and an Erik. :) Can't blame you too much!
>
>Why ....whatever do you mean....:-)
I assume the smiley means that you do understand, but let me know if you don't.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Turkey
Jason,
Probably too late, but I will be supporting you to Ion.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to France
I'm not sure what your thinking since I didn't get any response from my
last message.
Andy tells me he's threatened you about how he'll make you pay if you
attack him, but I don't see how he could possibly make any such threat stick.
In any case, I hope you aren't planning to help him pick up a build,
because that might make his threat more real.
Drop me a line if you get a chance.
--- Eric
Message from Italy to Russia
> >I dont normally say something like this, but this is a *teaching* game for
> >many of our observers...so I will...
> >
> >Never underestimate the short-sightedness of some players.
>
> Unless you are referring to the possibility that Erik might attack you I'm
> not sure what you mean.
That is exactly what I mean.
> >Erik and I have had that conversation and he knows the consequences of
> >attacking me at this juncture.
>
> I am sure you've had a conversation, but I can't see how you could make it
> stick. If EF coordinate, F will get sufficient builds to ensure that he can
> take at least one of your centers, and that's enough to keep me from
> soloing. Even if they don't Erik gets pretty secure. And I'm not likely to
> be able to hold a strong enough position to slow you down
He can take 1 dot from me right now, that I can replace with YOUR dot.
Absolutely worst case I am at 2, and you get to choose what I keep and my
units are at your bidding.....
The boot becomes a very differnt animal if you have 2 extra units around
it.
> > > I guess our interaction the last few turns makes it hard to differentiate
> > > between an Eric and an Erik. :) Can't blame you too much!
> >
> >Why ....whatever do you mean....:-)
>
> I assume the smiley means that you do understand, but let me know if
you don't.
I do....
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> >Too bad for you, Mr. Stabber.
>
> "Mr. Stabber"? :) I *told* you I was going to try for the solo. I don't
> think it counts as a stab if I tell you it's coming, but if it does,
that's
> the easiest stab to defend against you'll ever get.
And I *still* lost BER!
> >Well, obviously a two-way will call for some (a) concessions or (b) poor
> >guesses by you, as you currently have too many of the northern border
> >provinces. But that can be arranged, in time, if you're serious.
>
> I was, and I do think I already made the poor guesses, but to be honest,
> I'm not expecting to see a set of moves that encourages a two way. If we
> don't then I think I'd be ready to accept a three way -- I'm continuing to
> have difficulty finding time for the game, and as the board resolves
itself
> the press aspect alone is less interesting.
I generally like the earlier part of the game more, too. I am *trying* to
learn something about tactics. . . As I said - *eventually* I will
probably need BER back - no need to rush it right now, though.
> > > Oh, and I'm out of town from mid-week to mid-week. So in addition to
the
> > > lovely delay I caused this week, I'll cause another next week. :)
> >Oh, great. Mr. Tardy Stabber.
>
> Well, Tardy lack-of-sticking-with-2-way more than anything. :)
Heh. Gutsy2 looked like it would be over ages ago, but it's a wild
position in the mid '20s now - don't give up on anything yet. . .
Ben
Message from Russia to England
>> but to be honest,
>> I'm not expecting to see a set of moves that encourages a two way. If we
>> don't then I think I'd be ready to accept a three way -- I'm continuing to
>> have difficulty finding time for the game, and as the board resolves
>> itself the press aspect alone is less interesting.
> I generally like the earlier part of the game more, too. I am *trying* to
> learn something about tactics. . . As I said - *eventually* I will
> probably need BER back - no need to rush it right now, though.
If we go three way I doubt it. If we push for a two way then you will
definitely need it back (and, on the assumption that you are all combining to
take Mun, I'll probably need it back). Agreed, the rush isn't there until and
unless we're pushing for the two way.
>> Well, Tardy lack-of-sticking-with-2-way more than anything. :)
> Heh. Gutsy2 looked like it would be over ages ago, but it's a wild
> position in the mid '20s now - don't give up on anything yet. . .
There's a large difference between "giving up" and "not having enough time to
enjoy the process". I'm willing to push the units around to get a better
result if we can do it and it helps others to enjoy the game more, at this
point I'd be willing to accept a three way based on (1) my conviction that a
solo is no longer likely forthcoming and (2) the fact that I'm just not
really enjoying the game that much at this point. I still like seeing move
results that go well (like two seasons ago) and cringe when I see bad ones
(like last season). But the real fun for me is the kind of discussions we had
earlier on, and both because of my lack of availability and the more
black-and-white position on the board, that's not really part of the game
anymore.
I know, this is dreary stuff. I'll try to be more upbeat in future messages.
But I just wanted to clarify that it isn't lack of belief that we *could* get
to a 2-way that was motivating my statements.
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
I wrote early on to the gallery that I thought you & I were similar in style & personality. I've grown more and more sure of it as c2 has moved on. . .
Ben
England: Fleet Baltic Sea → Berlin (*bounce*)
England: Fleet Barents Sea SUPPORT Army Norway → St Petersburg
England: Fleet English Channel → North Sea (*bounce*)
England: Army Holland → Kiel
England: Fleet Kiel → Helgoland Bight
England: Army Livonia → Moscow (*bounce, destroyed*)
England: Fleet North Atlantic Ocean HOLD
England: Fleet North Sea → Norway (*bounce*)
England: Army Norway → St Petersburg
England: Army Ruhr SUPPORT Italian Army Tyrolia → Munich
England: Army Sweden → Finland (*bounce*)
France: Army Brest HOLD
France: Army Burgundy SUPPORT Italian Army Tyrolia → Munich
France: Fleet Gulf of Lyon → Tyrrhenian Sea (*bounce*)
France: Fleet Tunis SUPPORT Fleet Tyrrhenian Sea → Ionian Sea
France: Fleet Tyrrhenian Sea → Ionian Sea (*bounce*)
Italy: Fleet Adriatic Sea SUPPORT Army Rome → Venice
Italy: Army Rome → Venice
Italy: Army Tyrolia → Munich
Russia: Fleet Aegean Sea SUPPORT Turkish Fleet Eastern Mediterranean → Ionian Sea
Russia: Army Albania SUPPORT Army Venice → Trieste
Russia: Army Berlin HOLD
Russia: Fleet Black Sea → Constantinople
Russia: Army Bohemia → Vienna
Russia: Fleet Bulgaria (south coast) → Greece
Russia: Army Constantinople → Bulgaria
Russia: Army Finland → Norway (*bounce*)
Russia: Army Moscow SUPPORT Army St Petersburg → Livonia
Russia: Army Munich → Bohemia
Russia: Army Prussia SUPPORT Army Berlin
Russia: Army Silesia → Warsaw
Russia: Army St Petersburg → Livonia
Russia: Army Venice → Trieste
Turkey: Fleet Eastern Mediterranean → Ionian Sea (*bounce*)
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