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Austria: Army Budapest can retreat to Trieste
Message from Russia to Germany
Damn! I should have taken you up on your offer. Swe-Den, Bal S Ber-Kie would
have been a devastating move. I got a message from Ben right before the
deadline asking for support for Den-Kie, and I assumed you had worked out a
plan to work with him (Den-Kie, Kie-Hol, Nth S Ruh-Bel was what I was
expecting) and thus would not try to take Kie. If I'd only known.
I may well have soured you on working with me, but I'm willing to help you
out. You still have Ber, and if I keep Mun that's a fine exchange. Let me
know what you are thinking at this point.
--- Eric
Message from Italy to England
Well done Ben,
Now cut out his bloody heart.
Message from Italy to France
Erik,
Its good that you werent coming for me or anything....or else I might be
in a spot.
England is going to take 2 from you now, and you will be dead soon.
Have fun.
Message from Italy to Italy
I told the Russian that I would write a press to myself as if I were in
his position last turn, and how I would be planning my solo....
Here goes.
Fall 04'
At this point, its not time to make hay with Englnad. but it is time to
set up the Turk for the stab.
But only if things seem to be good, and they seem to be good, because he
just supported you to a dot you can never get by yourself, at least not in
the short term.
You should be convincing your ally the French, to support Munich for you
while you are *supposedly* taking Denmark. Use the same horsheshit excuses
for leaving him swinging in the breeze last fall, that you have been
giving me the whole game. He will probably believe them.
Oh...and you have to convince the Turk that he can take the ION
Let the English get very involved with the French before you move on him.
Moves....:
F Rum - Bul
A BUD s A TRI - SER
A SEV - ARM
F BAL s A SIL - BER
A SIL - BER
A MUN s A SIL - BER
A NWY h
I think I am going to do this on a turn by turn basis from here on out....
Message from Russia to Russia
I'm in Mun? I'm in MUN? WTF is that?!? I don't want to be in Mun. How the
heck am I supposed to hold Bud without that unit? Oh well, maybe I can get
Jason to support me with Ser. The irony is that any of the moves I was
anguishing over would have worked: Sev-Arm, Rum-Sev, Gal-Rum? I'd still be
golden. Swe-Den, Bal S Den-Kie? I'd have two northern builds (net) and damned
good position.
And did Ben just completely let me off the hook? Wow, he must really be mad
with Erik. The only thing that went wrong is that Philippe didn't get bounced
in Alb (more accurately, he didn't hold in Tri), but I knew Andy was too good
to press the attack on Philippe without my explicit help. I thought seriously
about offering him Tri, but I didn't think he'd take it. I was counting on
Bud not having a retreat. And having Tyl around to try and help me out there.
Oh well, I still don't think I can afford to complain.
I do think I've made some really bad move choices in the game so far; a
better player would be much further along in position. But with the
opposition I've faced so far, I'm guessing the AI's on the DiploAI project
could have gotten this position. I don't know if it's good diplomacy or just
dumb luck, but so far I think I've only faced two attacks (Ank-Arm in S01,
and Ska-Swe last Fall). I won't be counting on that kind of fortune lasting
forever.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to France
I'm in Mun? I'm in MUN? WTF is that?!? I don't want to be in Mun. That was
intended to bounce with Tony's Ruh army and insure it got disbanded (I
assumed that you would order Bel or Hol S Bur-Ruh, Gas-Bur). I wanted Boh for
the south.
I guess Ben wasn't as okay with Iri as you thought. Obviously he told me he
was attacking you, but I figured, what else would he say. It didn't seem
worth passing on. My apologies if me saying something would have made a
difference.
Well, what next? I certainly don't need to keep Mun, and you are clearly more
in need of builds than I am. I could easily move Mun-Ber with support, and
could still support you to Mun if you need it. Or whatever. That was kind of
a massive rearrangement of the board, and I was so sure he was coming after
me that I'm still kind of reeling. Let me know what you think.
--- Eric
Message from Russia to Austria
Darn! I just lost a long press to you I was composing. Well, probably better
to keep it short.
For what it's worth, I'm sorry I moved to Bud. I honestly didn't expect it to
succeed (Turkey did offer support, but when you said he offerred you Ser, I
wasn't sure what he was up to), but I was at a loss for what to do. You'll
note that I spent a lot of time trying to figure out how cooperating with you
against IT would futher our positions. But it definitely sounded like you
were not interested in moving against T and in fact planned to support T
against me. I am not against you protecting yourself and was (and still am)
happy to see you grow, but not in a way that makes my position stagnant.
I hope it's clear that I don't have anything against you. It really bothers
me to have undercut the goodwill and working relationship we've had. I really
don't want to be fighting you, though that is clearly the situation I've set
up with my move. But there *are* lots of ways for us to continue to cooperate
if you are so inclined, including several that don't require me to stay in
Bud. So if I haven't completely honked you off, we can still work together
and get you growth.
Let me know what you are thinking. I'll keep in touch, even if we are fated
to be fighting for a while.
--- Eric
Message from France to Italy
>
> Its good that you werent coming for me or anything....or else I might be
> in a spot.
>
>
> England is going to take 2 from you now, and you will be dead soon.
>
> Have fun.
>
Well, you're not exactly long for this world, either. See you on the
comments board shortly.
Erik
Message from Russia to Turkey
Well, the north went better than expected, so Rum is certainly yours.
Unfortunately, Austria's move to Alb means he'll still have that army. Here's
my move suggestions:
Bla-Rum
Bul S Gre
Ser S Bud
Rum-Sev
This ensures I hold Bud, you hold Gre, you get Rum, and it gives you the
ability to move Aeg-Eas or Aeg-Ion (I don't know if you want to, but it seems
like you need to consider covering Eas/Ion in case Andy moves that way. We
both get builds, while Austria and Italy each go down one.
What do you think?
--- Eric
Message from France to England
Well, I guess south wasn't the best direction for me after all. Should have
staying in Iri where there was trouble. Good thing Turkey is strong enough
to cut through Italy all by himself, or I'd be in trouble -- as it is, I
can more or less hold him off with one hand and come back and bicker with
you.
So what's the plan? Bounce in Bre? Or are you taking Hol and Bel? Maybe
I'll move to Nao just to mix things up a little. I'm just glad Russia took
Munich; that puts him at seven and gives him a huge boost. If you're going
to rain down on me with your fleets, I'd like to see a Russian victory as
a result.
Erik
Message from Italy to France
> Well, you're not exactly long for this world, either. See you on the
> comments board shortly.
>
ONly if you give up your position totally and attack me without regard for
protecting what you have left.
Otherwise, there is alot of time for me. I wont be losing 2 this year. And
if I can work it right, I am building.
Have fun.
Message from Russia to Italy
Well, now I want to know how I did according to what you would have advised
me!
So what's your thinking? Do you want to see me stopped, or do you still want
to "cut out Philippe's heart"? I know I'm getting to be a threat, but I don't
know if I'm the lesser of the evils of "allies" that you face. Hopefully it
was helpful that I didn't give you false hopes that I was going to be working
with you last season, even though I didn't do anything that helped you.
So, if you know Philippe was vacating Tri, would you have moved there
yourself?
--- Eric
Message from Russia to England
I'm in Mun? Incontheivable!
I don't even WANT to be in Mun -- I wanted Boh to help in the south. But it
does make it less likely that Mun will end up French, doesn't it? :)
I'm still digesting the moves. You have a TON of options, and Erik must be
quite the nervous wreck, having just honked Andy off and going on the
assumption that you and he were okay. I kind of expect that Tony and Erik
will combine to try to take Mun, so I'd suggest Mun S Kie, and if they take
Mun, then it ensures that Hol falls. Or we could do Mun-Kie (expecting it to
bounce with Ber-Kie), Kie-Hol with all sorts of support, Sil-Ber with Bal
supporting, and FG both take big hits. Or Mun could support Kie in place.
I think Mun-Kie makes more sense, because Ber-Kie is still Tony's obvious
move, but I will understand if that makes you too nervous. Let me know.
--- Eric
Message from Italy to Russia
> Well, now I want to know how I did according to what you would have advised
> me!
You will see the press when we are done...its going to be ongoing for the
rest of the game.
> So what's your thinking? Do you want to see me stopped, or do you still want
> to "cut out Philippe's heart"?
We are at a point where you would have to show me in a HUGE way that I
wouldnt be the next course of the RT meal.
I know I'm getting to be a threat, but I don't
> know if I'm the lesser of the evils of "allies" that you face.
I dont know what you mean here.
Hopefully it
> was helpful that I didn't give you false hopes that I was going to be working
> with you last season, even though I didn't do anything that helped you.
Didnt maek a difference, I wouldnt have believed any promise you made me.
you had no reason to keep your word to me.
> So, if you know Philippe was vacating Tri, would you have moved there
> yourself?
Probably not.
So..what can you offer me. Its going to take you a while to get another
army in position to force this situation.
How do you see the board right now....who do you stab and when??
Andy
Message from Russia to Italy
>> I know I'm getting to be a threat, but I don't
>> know if I'm the lesser of the evils of "allies" that you face.
>
>I dont know what you mean here.
I mean that I don't know if you're more worried about me and my position, or
more angry with Philippe and Jason for continuing to pursue you. I suspect
the former at this point.
>> So, if you know Philippe was vacating Tri, would you have moved there
>> yourself?
>
>Probably not.
Not surprising.
>So..what can you offer me.
Well, it depends on what you want. There are certainly ways I could distract
Turkey and perhaps help you regain Gre (though I doubt that could happen by
Fall unless Philippe helps you). But would you be okay with gaining on Jason
and Philippe in a way that also helps my position?
> Its going to take you a while to get another
> army in position to force this situation.
No doubt, and that's assuming I even hold the position I have.
> How do you see the board right now....
Well, if Boh-Mun had bounced as I thought it would, I'd probably offer you
Vie (and by extension, Tri next year). But whatever our relationship, I don't
want to see Jason get a free pass into Italy, so I'd like to see you get some
units to slow him down. I don't know if that means stabbing him necessarily
-- helping you acheives much of the same goal, I think.
The west is a mess, but I think a good mess from my point of view. The south
is hard to read. You clearly showed good will to Philippe, to an extent
showed it to Jason, and neither appeared to trust it. You and Philippe seem
to have a really odd relationship. Is there some history there, or did you
both just hit it off really badly in early negotiations?
> who do you stab and when??
At this point I'm really not sure what I'm going to do next -- it's too early
in the turn (you can see why I envy your FtF skills). I clearly don't need
any more builds than I appear to have now; though I may need more dots, since
I can't necessarily hold either I'm on right now.
--- Eric
Message from France to Italy
>
> ONly if you give up your position totally and attack me without regard
> for
> protecting what you have left.
Who knows? I might do that. It could be fun. You haven't given me much of a
reason not too. As you've pointed out, I'm apparently losing two, so why
shouldn't I dig in and pick on you while I'm still around?
Andy, with all due respect, you haven't really given me much of a reason
*not* to attack you this game. You don't share information with me, you
don't ever have any kind of constructive proposals, you send cryptic, two
line messages, and now, instead of actually trying to negotiate with me,
you're gloating. I suspect that if you hadn't been so busy trying to deal
with your two neighbors, you would have come after me long ago, especially
once it was clear that Tony wasn't going to be the board-sweeping threat
that you constantly, constantly, constantly, constantly swore he would be.
I stopped sending you any kind of meaningful press long ago becuase
frankly, it's been a completely useless experience this game.
So yeah, maybe I will give up my position totally and attack you. It will
at least keep me occupied for a little while and make my downfall
entertaining.
Erik
Message from England to France
Erik -
> Well, I guess south wasn't the best direction for me after all. Should
have
> staying in Iri where there was trouble. Good thing Turkey is strong enough
> to cut through Italy all by himself, or I'd be in trouble -- as it is, I
> can more or less hold him off with one hand and come back and bicker with
> you.
>
> So what's the plan? Bounce in Bre? Or are you taking Hol and Bel? Maybe
> I'll move to Nao just to mix things up a little. I'm just glad Russia took
> Munich; that puts him at seven and gives him a huge boost. If you're going
> to rain down on me with your fleets, I'd like to see a Russian victory as
> a result.
If you say so.
Look, Erik, I didn't want to attack you and I wasn't planning on it. You
can't go silent on me for days on end and expect me not to wonder what's
going on.
I'm not sure what the plan is. But I'll think about a way to untangle this
mess. More tomorrow - it's late.
Ben
Message from France to England
Ben:
I'm sorry, my math is a little off. Russia's going to have at least nine
this turn, not eight, and unless you're planning on support A Ber, he'll
probably have ten. So, after this turn, that puts us at:
Russia 10
Germany 0
France 5
England 7
Austria 1 or 2
Italy 4 or 5
Turkey 6
I think you can count on F StP (nc), and you'll be building fleets in Lon
and Edi, of course. I'll be disbanding my southern armies and swinging
everything back north. I figure that Turkey will start chewing up Italy in
a turn or two, while Russia picks up Vienna and slips into Kiel and
Berlin. That will put him at about 13, and a well-timed stab into Bul and
Ank will push him closer to 18. You've got a lot of fleets, but they're
going to be pretty far from Scandanavia when he comes pushing down for
those last few spots.
Or, of course, you could back down and maybe just take Holland. Then I
could keep heading south, as I so clearly started doing, and you could
stop Russia from running away with the game. Your call.
Erik
Message from France to England
> Look, Erik, I didn't want to attack you and I wasn't planning on it.
> You
> can't go silent on me for days on end and expect me not to wonder what's
> going on.
It's a little late, but I will plead technical difficulties on that count.
Poorly timed, but true nevertheless.
> I'm not sure what the plan is. But I'll think about a way to untangle
> this
> mess. More tomorrow - it's late.
>
There's another whiny message in your inbox from me. I was more or less
sincere in my reasoning for moving to Lvp; I thought Russia and Germany
were going to start a feeding frenzy, and I figured it was safer for me in
the long run to take part than see the two of them grow even bigger.
Obviously, that's not the way things turned out, so I apologize again for
my brazen selfishness.
You were concerned about Russia before and you have even more reason to be
concerned now. I've headed south, as promised and could easily plug some
gaps or take out the Italian, depending on what's needed. Please don't
make me come defend myself and leave the board for the Juggernaut -- which
has been real the whole time I think, whether carefully planned or not. I
swear I won't get all quiet on you again.
Erik
Message from Germany to Russia
Well I was meant to be saying "told you so" to Ben and not to you.
I am not to fussed. I am willing to attack KIE again with support from BAL & MUN. This would allow you to push SIL - BER. Ofcourse you could just take BER on your own. You could also move NWY - SWE in preperation for taking DEN next year.
If you would have gone with my last suggestion then it would have indeed been devestating for Ben.
Anyway I will order BER - KIE. All I can do is wait.
Message from Germany to France and Russia
I will order RUH s HOL.
Message from Germany to Germany
Well once again I am amazed that Ben didnt move north. Russia is quite happy to let EF fight it out. When the time comes he will move in and remove England from the once french SC's.
It will be interesting to see when he moves on Turkey. Probably not until Germany, Austria and Italy has fallen.
I will expect to see him defend his northern front better this year.
As you know he was kicking himself for not taking my offer.
Holland may fall, I will support it as mentioned. Once again I am better off with someone soloing.
England has moved on France to much to pull back. The only one to gain will be Russia.
Merry Christmas to all and a happy new year.
Message from Germany to England
Well as predicted GRE & BUD fell.
MUN has fallen and BER will fall.
Three builds for Russia aint bad. I am putting my bet on a fleet in STP(NC) and an army in MOS and WAR. If he bides his time I would just build F STP and army MOS. Save one build for next year and get a second fleet into STP. He will be quite happy letting you and France slog it out. Once you remove a frog then Russia will come up behind and remove you. I think you lost your last chance to put pressure on him.
Oh yeah, he was supposed to support BER - KIE from BAL, move SWE - DEN and SIL - BER. I bet he is kicking himself that he didnt. But with 3 builds he wont have to worry.
Good luck for the remaining part of the game Ben. I hope Russia doesnt take your last minute request for support to KIE to heart.
Message from Austria to Russia
Eric,
> For what it's worth, I'm sorry I moved to Bud. I honestly didn't expect it to
> succeed (Turkey did offer support, but when you said he offerred you Ser, I
> wasn't sure what he was up to), but I was at a loss for what to do. You'll
> note that I spent a lot of time trying to figure out how cooperating with you
> against IT would futher our positions. But it definitely sounded like you
> were not interested in moving against T and in fact planned to support T
> against me. I am not against you protecting yourself and was (and still am)
> happy to see you grow, but not in a way that makes my position stagnant.
Come on, I was pretty clear about my intent and you knew
I wasn't a threat for you. That's what made it easy for you to
proceed without covering Gal.
> I hope it's clear that I don't have anything against you. It really bothers
> me to have undercut the goodwill and working relationship we've had. I really
> don't want to be fighting you, though that is clearly the situation I've set
> up with my move. But there *are* lots of ways for us to continue to cooperate
> if you are so inclined, including several that don't require me to stay in
> Bud. So if I haven't completely honked you off, we can still work together
> and get you growth.
>
> Let me know what you are thinking. I'll keep in touch, even if we are fated
> to be fighting for a while.
Well, I'm listening. If I'm not mistaken, you are asking for
support into Ser and I'm happy to oblige.
Philippe
Message from Italy to France
Erik,
> Who knows? I might do that. It could be fun. You haven't given me much of a
> reason not too. As you've pointed out, I'm apparently losing two, so why
> shouldn't I dig in and pick on you while I'm still around?
You could look at it that way. Or you could try to convince the Russian to
keep his side of your bargain.....whatever that bargain was.
> Andy, with all due respect, you haven't really given me much of a reason
> *not* to attack you this game. You don't share information with me, you
> don't ever have any kind of constructive proposals, you send cryptic, two
> line messages, and now, instead of actually trying to negotiate with me,
> you're gloating.
Erik...first...Im sorry...Im not trying to sound like I am gloating...but
as I reread it....it sure as hell looks like gloating to me.
With all due respect, you havent giving any reason to share information
with you, we entered this game with the WORST kind of history, and you
moved on me in Spring of 01' only to back off and hover like a gargoyle
waiting to attack for the next 2 years. You have had 2 opportunities to
build and both of them included a Fleet in Marsaille...what does that tell
your Italian neighbor.
I suspect that if you hadn't been so busy trying to deal
> with your two neighbors, you would have come after me long ago, especially
> once it was clear that Tony wasn't going to be the board-sweeping threat
> that you constantly, constantly, constantly, constantly swore he would be.
This is where you are totally wrong, as the end of game summarys will play
out, I have told all of my eastern cousins, that I wont attack you, its
impossible at this point.
And as expected Russia has fueld the fire that if I am not attacking you,
I have to attack Austria and Turkey.
> I stopped sending you any kind of meaningful press long ago becuase
> frankly, it's been a completely useless experience this game.
You have NEVER sent me meaningful press....you have picked my brain, but
offered nothing in return for my mantra that Germany must die, even at the
beginning. You have to give to recieve in this game, and with the very
current history we walked in with, we were way behind the curve already.
> So yeah, maybe I will give up my position totally and attack you. It will
> at least keep me occupied for a little while and make my downfall
> entertaining.
That is your call, but you position is far from hopeless, and with some
negotiation with the Russian, I think you could make a solid comeback on
England.
just my .02
Andy
Message from England to France
Erik -
I have an idea - it will require a leap of faith and some dot-swapping - are
you still ready to work with me?
If you are, let me know; I'll fill you in.
Ben
Message from Austria to Italy
Andy,
Any suggestion?
Philippe
Message from England to France
Erik -
Can you arrange the capture of MUN with Tony (don't really care which of you
is capturing - as long as it's not Russian)? I'm reluctant to put my
fingerprints on it right now - it would look more natural coming from you.
Ben
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
> I'm in Mun? Incontheivable!
[I know a softball when I see it:] You keep using that word. . .
> I don't even WANT to be in Mun -- I wanted Boh to help in the
> south. But it
> does make it less likely that Mun will end up French, doesn't it? :)
:o)
> I'm still digesting the moves. You have a TON of options, and
> Erik must be
> quite the nervous wreck, having just honked Andy off and going on the
> assumption that you and he were okay. I kind of expect that
> Tony and Erik
> will combine to try to take Mun, so I'd suggest Mun S Kie,
> and if they take
> Mun, then it ensures that Hol falls. Or we could do Mun-Kie
> (expecting it to
> bounce with Ber-Kie), Kie-Hol with all sorts of support,
> Sil-Ber with Bal
> supporting, and FG both take big hits. Or Mun could support
> Kie in place.
I'm turning it over. We're still in the retreat phase - plenty of time.
> I think Mun-Kie makes more sense, because Ber-Kie is still
> Tony's obvious
> move, but I will understand if that makes you too nervous.
> Let me know.
I will.
Ben
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
> Well done Ben,
>
> Now cut out his bloody heart.
This sort of makes me want to play with the Pitkissers, and sort of makes me
alittle nervous. ;o)
Can you offer support for RUH - MUN?
Ben
Austria: Army Budapest → Trieste
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