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England: Builds 2 units
France: Builds 1 unit
Germany: Removes 2 units
Italy: Builds 1 unit
Turkey: Builds 1 unit
Message from Austria to England
Ben,
Sorry to see that I was right about France. Do you
know why he went your way instead of Andy?
Regards,
Philippe.
P.-S. With Jason actually attacking Andy, I would
like to know what he told you about Russia.
Message from England to Austria
Philippe -
> Sorry to see that I was right about France. Do you
> know why he went your way instead of Andy?
It surprised me because I don't think it was in his best interest, but I think he felt Andy's influence more than my own. :-( He will have a long ugly fight to get anything from me, though, while instead he could be cleaning the Italian clock.
> P.-S. With Jason actually attacking Andy, I would
> like to know what he told you about Russia.
Hm. Well, I'd suggested AT v R, and he wanted to know whether I thought that was preferable to AT v I, and I basically agreed. It was not a firm commitment but he seemed open to the idea. Keep it in mind.
Ben
Message from Turkey to England
Nice move into Germany. Looks like the I vs F attack didn't come off
yet, though. I assume A Gas will get convoyed soon enough.
Any chance of you taking advantage of Russia getting no builds this turn
in Scandinavia? Looks tasty. :-)
jason
Message from Austria to England
> It surprised me because I don't think it was in his best interest, but I think he felt Andy's influence more than my own. :-( He
will have a long ugly fight to get anything from me, though, while instead he could be cleaning the Italian clock.
I will see what I can learn on my side and get back to you.
One thing's for sure, with two builds, you will be ready to
receive him.
> Hm. Well, I'd suggested AT v R, and he wanted to know whether I thought that was preferable to AT v I, and I basically agreed.
It was not a firm commitment but he seemed open to the idea. Keep it in mind.
OK. I won't push for anything at first and just wait to see
what are his goals.
Philippe
Message from England to France
Erik -
I would have considered the same thing you did & I do not bear any grudge
for it at all.
Let's take a look at some of what we can expect now that the shoe has
dropped:
England: with two builds, will build in the south in a defensive posture.
The battle for French occupation of English centers will be slow and require
a near-complete use of the French forces.
Germany: crumbled, with BER to go to Russia
Russia:
Facing *zero* enemies - unless you include Germany. No doubt is *thrilled*
that England must now turn to face France, leaving most English holdings
vulnerable to Russia, to be taken at some point down the road, significantly
*after* French growth has stalled.
Italy:
Getting crushed in the Balkans. All three home centers and TUN are
vulnerable to France, as he pushes the units he has *east*. Meanwhile he
controls TUN, which is I believe a *necessary center* for France to solo.
Count the 18 yourself - I do not see how you solo without TUN, unless you
occupy WAR, or MOS. Moreover, TUN once held by you is easily defended.
Erik, as I see it you and I are in similar situations: I would benefit
fastest from attacking Scandinavia, and you would benefit fastest - not to
mention cross the stalemate line - by attacking Italy. But instead it
appears we *may* have to lock horns against each other, trying to scratch
out a difficult battle while good opportunities elsewhere dry up.
It is not too late for you to change your mind. I will build an A LVP and F
LON. It will not be an *offensive* build - it will rather be designed to
protect the home turf. You in IRI are perfectly well protected from me.
But if you choose to follow this path - building F BRE - then I will have to
pull back from the RG neighborhood to try to deal with you. I hope you see,
that better opportunites for you lay elsewhere.
If I was Italy, I would be encouraging France to attack England, to keep him
away from me. If I was Russia, I would be encouraging France to attack
England, to keep him away from me. If I was Germany, I would be encouraging
France to attack England, to break up the EF. But if I were *France*, I
would take this opportunity to reach across the stalemate line and stake my
claim to the Italian centers.
What do you think?
Ben
Message from England to Turkey
Jason -
> Nice move into Germany. Looks like the I vs F attack didn't come off
> yet, though. I assume A Gas will get convoyed soon enough.
Yes, but to where?
> Any chance of you taking advantage of Russia getting no
> builds this turn in Scandinavia? Looks tasty. :-)
It does. It depends on whether I can get Erik to press in the south. I
would appreciate your help in that regard; I /will/ be able to take the
exposed Scandinavian centers, if I can get Erik out of my hindquarters. You
can let Erik know of my intentions, if you think it will help.
Ben
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
Grr. EF conflict is supposed to happen on *my* terms! Dammit.
It seems to me EF conflict is probably ok with you, and I imagine it is in
your best interest to see me put up a good fight. When the time comes, will
you coordinate a defense with me? I would probably benefit from your
(counter)intelligence, as Erik is starting out with the advantage, and it is
not in your best interest for me to get steamrolled.
What do you make of the fall?
Ben
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
Well I see you dissuaded Erik from the bounce. Thanks a damned lot. ;-)
Now in the North I cannot face Russia, despite Scandinavia's vulnerability,
which means Russia will clean up, and I think you are about to get crushed
under the heel of an RT.
Thoughts?
Ben
Message from Russia to England
What do I make of the Fall?
I made a huge blunder that I compounded with a minor blunder that really
weakened my overall position. You'll see details when you review the press,
but it had nothing to do with you or the EFG triangle. I'm still cursing
myself for it.
As to EF conflict, I was reasonably certain that would happen. This may be
undermining my credibility with you, but basically I ended up kind of
encouraging him. As you say, it doesn't hurt me to have you and him fighting,
so that was somewhat selfishly motivated. But moreso it was clear that Erik
*really* wanted to attack you, and Tony really wanted me to attack you. I got
messages from both Tony and Erik saying that they wanted me to attack you in
Den, and making it clear they had discussed it (as I think I told you). The
problem was that Erik was so interested that I was reasonably certain that if
I told him I was helping you, then he might have tipped off Tony, in which
case Tony wouldn't have moved Kie, in which case you wouldn't have gotten the
build which (as you pointed out) made Erik's attack ineffective.
So you are likely to find that Erik is just as annoyed with me for misleading
him as anything else. I'd worry about being so frank with you, but I expect
you'll hear much of this from Tony and Erik. FGR is actually kind of a mess
right now. Erik probably truly expected me to support Tony to Den, and BOTH
Erik and I expected Tony to move on Den and not on Hol. So there's tons of
animosity to go around.
I also want to apologize for Nwy-Swe. I realized about 1am that it was
actually counter productive for me (Nwy is better for defending both StP and
Swe, Swe is more threatening to you, but I can't afford to threaten you right
now). I can only say that in the late hours before the deadline I was so
frazzled by the blunder I referred to above that I just copied over the
orders Tony and I had "agreed" to, and then changed the support on Bal. At
the very last minute I thought I should tap Ber because it would be REALLY
ugly if you didn't get Kie and Tony was pissed about it!
As for coordinating defenses, here's my thinking: if I can get Mun and Ber
(which may be difficult) then I am DONE in the north. I will effectively
proxy those units to you, moving things away from you and into the south or
defensive positions in north. We're still in that sort of Mexican stand off
position where either of us could majorly burn the other, but as I keep
stressing, I'm looking simply to put up a defense in the north and seek
better pastures south. If I do well, I'll look to solo through southern
gains. If (as looks much more likely) I am stymied, I'll try to set up a
defensive line and go for a 2-way or 3-way. I would be happy for you to be
one of the other players in a draw.
And as another argument for ongoing ER cooperation, Turkey is looking pretty
strong in the south. He's likely to make Tun before you can, especially if
you and I are fighting. So in looking at keeping a Turkish solo from
happening (not that far fetched a concern at the moment) you'll want to make
sure I have a strong southern line as well.
Those are my thoughts at the moment. Anything from your side?
--- Eric
Message from England to Russia
Eric -
I will keep this short & will try to give a more thorough response later.
In your shoes I would have been encouraging the French attack of E as well -
it worked out well for you. What you want, as I see it, is an unstable west
with your nearest ally being the one who needs you most.
That's me!
So don't worry about ER; right now I hope you agree it is much more useful
to you than GRF, which would mean your nearest neighbors would be a big F
and a dangerous G, neither of whom would *need* you. So we are good, and I
thank you for being straight with me.
I think we are on the same page - still - the best thing for you will be my
stout defense from France. I will certainly help you to BER/MUN, though as
you can see for right now I'm not exactly in a position to *support* you
into MUN. Still, there are other ways I should be able to help.
I am very pleased with ER right now & you mustn't worry yourself about it.
In a way I was glad to see the French attack - it means I get to build
without having to step on anyone's toes.
Ben
Message from Germany to England, France, and Russia
First off; Congratulations to Ben on his two builds, I would have preferred
they came from RG rather than just G.
Secondly, well done Eric (Russia).
Thirdly; it is not to late for the three of you to surrender to me. I will
be leniant and forgive you your trespasses against me, however continue down
this foolish path and none of you will survive to see 1905.
Analysis:
Observation:
1 - Doesnt that fleet in IRI look a lot like the army we saw in s1901m in
PIE ;-)
2- I was hoping on 4 sc's. Having only two left is still 50% positive news
Facts as I saw them, in message to observers before fall moves
1 - Russian proposal never taken seriously (expect attack on BER)
2 - Move to BOH expected
3 - Juggernaut to show through
4 - attack on Greece expected
Assumptions in message to observers
1 - Russia wouldnt follow through on support of DEN - KIE
2 - Ben would opt for DEN and NWY with my blessing
3 - EG will be screwed by FR (france wont move on iri)
4 - EFR to continue attack on G
All 4 wrong, I must stick to facts in the future ;-)
Analysis to date:
Russia hoping for EF conflict to allow juggernaut to take over
Germany/Italy. Builds gained to be deployed in north(STP) and warsaw area.
What does surprise me (but we all live and hopefully learn) is the
following.
It was always apparent that England would receive two builds. I was willing
to let him keep Denmark and hoped that he would push for Norway whilst I
retook Holland and that we jointly protected Berlin. That would have left me
the 4 sc's I expected. It also meant tha Ben had an escape and wouldnt be
caught up between RF once I am gone. It also meant that at least in the
north we could take on the juggernaut which I have been preaching all along.
I didnt expect Russia to support Ben, two english builds isnt in Russia's
interest (unless they are used against france).
We know the EF alliance has been stable over the last few years. France
managed to talk his way out of the situation in Italy. I am sure he will
talk his way out of the situation in IRI. Now and then his front line units
seem to have a wil of their own. Italy and I am sure England accept this and
will excuse it.
The talks during the fall involved EG working together and EFR working
together. I just had to keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best. I did
all the diploming, false messaging etc. that I could think of to convince
Ben that in the long run he is doomned unless he teams up with me or at
least with France.
Would France have moved to IRI if he knew that Russia was supporting England
into Denmark. My money says he wouldnt have. So maybe my analysis to date as
mentioned above is true. So was I the only one stabbed? indirectly I dont
think so. Ben and Erik (france) have been set up nicely by Eric(Russia).
Ben, do you really want to be pushed into a war with France and let the
juggernaut profit. Visit the USSR before the USSR visits you. Russia would
like nothing more than you and France to slog it out until RT get into place
to "HELP" you and France. Russia via the north and Turkey via the south.
So which two units do I disband and whos puppet do I become until I wipe you
all out in 1905.
I am sure EF can sort out IRI.
A fleet build in BRE allows for SPA - WES, MAR - GOL, IRI - MAO. In the fall
you get MAO - NAF. BY spring France is in TUN. Block one against the
JUGGERNAUT.
England builds two fleets, one in EDI and LON. I keep BER and MUN. EFG can
hold MUN/BER long enough for Ben to take NWY in the fall. Block two against
the JUGGERNAUT.
Dont be surprised to see RT get Italy to take TRI whilst they attack and
take GRE and BUD.
No matter if it's an austrian or italian unit in TRI it will be removed once
RT meet up there.
The short term Italian gain will vanish like snow in the sun.
Thats how I see Bens gains. Very temporary indeed.
Russia has saved his northern frontier for now and lost nothing and even
gained false friendship. He will push the RF versus England but in reality
it will be an EF battle whilst RT inch their way forward. No doubt he will
want at least an army build in LVP but he will prefer a fleet build instead.
No doubt he will ask/insist on a fleet in LVP/LON.
This is Russia's crucial year. He needs a build this year to close the
gaping whole in his defence up north. It's the last window of opportunity
for England/France.
If Russia can keep Bens friendship just one more year the build in STP will
be a fact and the long hot showers between them will be over.
I hope the western alliance which we have hidden well up until now springs
its trap on Russia.
Erik, I am sure you will offer me a better deal as a Russian puppet.
Tony
Message from Italy to England
> Andy -
> Well I see you dissuaded Erik from the bounce. Thanks a damned lot. ;-)
Sorry.
> Now in the North I cannot face Russia, despite Scandinavia's vulnerability,
> which means Russia will clean up, and I think you are about to get crushed
> under the heel of an RT.
Dont face Russia, he is still a ways from you....build fleets in Liverpool
and London and shut down the French.
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
> > Well I see you dissuaded Erik from the bounce. Thanks a
> damned lot. ;-)
>
> Sorry.
You sir are a capital (Capitol?) jerk. After all the effort I put into
trying to get France to attack *you*, you persuaded him to attack *me*. I
take back my offer to buy you a beer, and I renounce all interest in the
Pitkissers.
At some point I would like to work with you to beat Erik like a drum. But
you need to get your affairs straight in the east, as far as I can tell.
> > Now in the North I cannot face Russia, despite
> Scandinavia's vulnerability,
> > which means Russia will clean up, and I think you are about
> to get crushed
> > under the heel of an RT.
>
> Dont face Russia, he is still a ways from you....build fleets
> in Liverpool
> and London and shut down the French.
No army for defense of the homeland? If I don't build it now I may never
get the chance. . .
Be well - I was just kidding about IRI. Good job.
Ben
Message from Turkey to England
I assume A Gas will be convoyed to Tus after moving to Spa. Then again,
Spa - Mao will convoy it to Lvp. At least you have builds to counter that.
I'll see what I can do with Russia. He's interested in AI right now, so
that should help you.
jason
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
Office network seems to have lost my response from a few hours ago. My
guess is, you'll get it mid-morning tomorrow. It went pretty much like
this:
> > Well I see you dissuaded Erik from the bounce. Thanks a damned lot.
;-)
>
> Sorry.
Jerk. I renounce my interest in the Pitkissers and I am not buying you a
beer. Hell with you! Some nerve, getting Erik to go after me, while I was
trying to get him to go after you!
> > Now in the North I cannot face Russia, despite Scandinavia's
vulnerability,
> > which means Russia will clean up, and I think you are about to get
crushed
> > under the heel of an RT.
>
> Dont face Russia, he is still a ways from you....build fleets in Liverpool
> and London and shut down the French.
You don't think I should build an army to defend the homeland? I'm worried
if I don't build it now, I won't get a chance.
Please get your stuff straight in the East, so you and I can go beat Erik
like a drum.
Thank you.
Ben
Message from England to France
Erik -
Without going into all the detail I was interested in Tony's note & it
certainly explains something to me, namely, why would you attack me if you
thought I was getting two builds. Answer, you didn't think I was getting
two builds. Russia played you for the bad guy, while he revs up his RT and
waits for my exposed back.
Well, that realization gave me some hope for our future, and makes me think
maybe I will not see a F BRE - why would you give him what he wants, when
he's played you like a drum?
But time will tell, on this one.
Ben
Message from England to England
Yes, the drum motif was for the benefit of you, the gallery.
The move to IRI was not a terrible surprise nor was the Russian support. I
was thinking my chances were slightly better with R then with G but there
was not much of a difference. I am pleased to be building twice and I do
not think Eric has much of a reason to rush in right now, though perhaps he
will. He can take the dots, but doesn't he want me keeping the lid on
Erik? We will see.
Ben
Message from Italy to England
Ben,
>
> Andy -
> Office network seems to have lost my response from a few hours ago. My
> guess is, you'll get it mid-morning tomorrow. It went pretty much like
> this:
>
> > > Well I see you dissuaded Erik from the bounce. Thanks a damned lot.
> ;-)
> >
> > Sorry.
> Jerk. I renounce my interest in the Pitkissers and I am not buying you a
> beer. Hell with you! Some nerve, getting Erik to go after me, while I was
> trying to get him to go after you!
Actually....all I did was tell him that I catagorically didnt want a
bounce in WES.
Im as surprised as your are.
> > > Now in the North I cannot face Russia, despite Scandinavia's
> vulnerability,
> > > which means Russia will clean up, and I think you are about to get
> crushed
> > > under the heel of an RT.
> >
> > Dont face Russia, he is still a ways from you....build fleets in Liverpool
> > and London and shut down the French.
> You don't think I should build an army to defend the homeland? I'm worried
> if I don't build it now, I won't get a chance.
I dont think you can afford to, you need as many fleets as will allow
right now, to protect all the ways to your island.
> Please get your stuff straight in the East, so you and I can go beat Erik
> like a drum.
Im working on it, but the Turk isnt being helpful at all.
take care
Andy
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
Reading between the lines of my last press from T, I am still confident he
believes there is an RT.
Ben
Message from Italy to England
>
> Andy -
> Reading between the lines of my last press from T, I am still confident he
> believes there is an RT.
Yeah...he gave me a lame ass line about building a fleet in Smyrna so that
the Russian doesnt get suspicious and that he will leave Greece
alone......
Message from England to Italy
Andy -
> Yeah...he gave me a lame ass line about building a fleet in
> Smyrna so that
> the Russian doesnt get suspicious and that he will leave Greece
> alone......
When I told you I'd write him about leaving you alone, what I suggested
specifically was AT v R. He told me there wasn't much of an A left anymore,
which is absurd, unless in his mind the red dots are white already. . .
Eric I think is quite the charmer. Anyway, here we go.
Ben
Message from Italy to England
> Andy -
> > Yeah...he gave me a lame ass line about building a fleet in
> > Smyrna so that
> > the Russian doesnt get suspicious and that he will leave Greece
> > alone......
> When I told you I'd write him about leaving you alone, what I suggested
> specifically was AT v R. He told me there wasn't much of an A left anymore,
> which is absurd, unless in his mind the red dots are white already. . .
Im leaving the Austrian alone.....entirely, unless he attacks me.
> Eric I think is quite the charmer. Anyway, here we go.
>
He is.
Message from England to Austria
Philippe -
I am pretty confident of two things right now:
1. RT is still on
2. Italy has no interest in fighting you.
I understand you might be reluctant to believe #2. But it will be important
to remember, if I'm right about #1.
No need to do anything immediately - I just wanted you to have this in the
back of your mind as you are studying your correspondence.
Ben
Message from France to England
Don't worry. No invasion planned.
It was a last minute decision. I needed to hang onto Holland, and to do so
required promising to move to Iri. I figured doing so would give me a
little more credibility with Germany down the road and give me a chance to
manipulate him a bit. I would have told you, but I didn't want you pulling
units back unnecessarily.
Clearly, with your two builds and without any other French units in the
area, I do not have a serious attack planned on your homeland. I hope you
will keep this in mind when you choose your builds.
More after the adjustments.
Erik
England: BUILD Fleet Liverpool
England: BUILD Fleet London
France: BUILD Fleet Marseilles
Germany: REMOVE Fleet Helgoland Bight
Germany: REMOVE Army Munich
Italy: BUILD Fleet Naples
Turkey: BUILD Fleet Smyrna
Centers
Austria: 3
England: 5
France: 7
Germany: 2
Italy: 5
Russia: 7
Turkey: 5
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